Selected Correspondence Peter
BARRY LONG: Peter,
Many people have sent me their books or manuscripts, and I never read them. So I am returning your nice looking book unopened.
Your persistence gives me the impression your are trying to teach me something or give me something that I have not asked for – a sure sign of guru-itis.
Freedom, of course, is always actual (as well as within) and if you have discovered it, I suggest you just enjoy it and stop trying to impress me. Incidentally, as I mentioned before, the love you say you’ve discovered is an emotion, is not the love I know.
PETER: I am a bit baffled by your response to me as I offered you a chance to comment on my discoveries about freedom and you refuse to even read them. I first sent you Richard’s manuscript and then a copy of my book and have had a summary dismissal both times.
Why is it that all of the spiritual teachers seem unwilling or unable to discuss or talk about their Truth. And why is it that when someone even presumes to question their teachings they are treated with disdain, scorn or accused of being a Guru. You are the one who declares himself ‘Guru’ and a ‘God-man’, and yet you accuse me of showing signs of Guru-it is. If you had taken the trouble to read even a bit of my book you would have realized that the last thing I am is a Guru. Far, far from it – 180 degrees in the opposite direction in fact.
I was always curious at your treatment of a former disciple and now a Spiritual Teacher, who freely acknowledges his debt to you as his teacher and yet you offer no comment, support, endorsement or anything. Has he discovered the same Truth as you? Is he a competitor, has he not got it ‘right’, is he somehow lesser? If anyone finds the Truth or God by being with you then what is their position? No doubt you will take offence by what I am questioning but this does not mean the questions are not valid. I always thought the Truth and its purveyors could stand a little questioning and I rather naively thought you might be of a different ilk, but it appears not.
Your comment on your brand of freedom being actual is non-sensical in that your definition is ‘Actuality is the apparent world outside the head’. So you adopt the traditional Eastern position that the physical stuff of the universe is apparent only, i.e. an illusion. Rocks, sky, computer keyboards, food, air, human beings, etc. are, for you, all an illusion – for me they are actual as clearly evidenced by the senses. The freedom that you talk about is to realise a state of consciousness where this perception of the physical world is experienced as an illusion, leading to a temporary, false sense of well-being and bliss. Unfortunately, this misconception, when fully realized leads to a state of delusion where one becomes timeless, spaceless and immortal. And yet another Saviour of mankind is born, resulting in yet another Religion, depending on the numbers of disciples he can gather.
Immortality is, of course, a grand play in the imagination, as in the actual world bodies die and rot and become compost. It is only in the psychic world that heaven and afterlife exist.
Up until now there has only been one door to ‘escape’ from the bondage of having a psychological and psychic entity that fearfully perceived the actual world as an illusionary hell inhabited by evil spirits. The door was marked ‘Truth’, ‘God’, ‘Enlightenment’ or such. This involved transcending the ‘earthly’ realm for some mythical ‘inner’ world or higher plane. To fully step through this door was to become the Self, Divine Love, God or the like.
Now for the first time there is another door that leads to an actual freedom where neither a self nor a Self exist. In actual freedom I am able to be what I am not who I am – this body, not this alien self inside. There is evidence that even the Enlightened Ones know this but they claim it is only possible to reach upon death, in some imaginary afterlife. That door, marked ‘annihilation’, is what I am now willingly rushing towards, now that I have sufficient actual evidence of the purity, perfection and fairy-tale like quality of the physical universe. And then fear – the very substance of self – will totally disappear and I can be me – this flesh and blood body only.
This discovery of a new down-to-earth, non-spiritual freedom will now relegate concepts such as spirituality and Enlightenment to history – into the curio section. Then the planet will eventually be free of Religion, Spirituality, Gurus, religious persecution and religious wars. In short, there will be heaven on earth, here, now – not in some mythical realm after death.
My persistence was to try and tell you of this new discovery. You are indeed ‘fiddling while Rome burns’ and as a fellow human being I thought it only fair to warn you, but twice you have imperiously swept my offer aside, refusing even to peek inside the cover of my book or Richard’s.
RESPONDENT: Peter, I just read a large portion of BL’s site and it reminded my of the ‘Western teacher’ in either your journal or other writings. Is this the man you studied with?
I found some of what he wrote insightful (of course I think he is at some level deluded with all his god talk delusions). He is clearly on record in his article ‘Love is not an Emotion’, saying that one must end ALL one’s emotions – the good and the bad. I don’t think I’ve heard anyone besides Richard say something like this. He also is against ALL religions and spiritualities (well he is clearly spiritual himself, but he is against ALL TRADITIONS of spirituality-yeah that’s more like it) ‘just like’ Richard. It was funny ‘watching’ the WHAT IS ENLIGHTENMENT editor fumble over himself in trying to comprehend how someone could live w/o emotions in an interview with BL (Barry Long).
RESPONDENT: I am enjoying my emancipation of what I consider a enormous delusion (God, angels, demons, afterlife) very much. There is no need/desire/want to go back to creating a fake mental reality. To me a Higher Power of any kind is like Santa for adults. Life is very simple and fun without all the spiritual stuff ‘junking’ it up. I’m so glad that the disappointments in my life have opened me up to leaving a superstitious way of living behind. AT beatup 30.12.2004
PETER: In the light of this, why you would still be interested in the preachings of a self-declared God-realized ‘Western Master’ has got me well and truly stumped.
As to your statement that he is ‘he is against ALL TRADITIONS of religion and spiritualities’ –
… this sounds mightily like very TRADITIONAL spiritual-speak to me.
I have no interest in writing yet more about my experiences of the hypocrisy of the spiritual teachings and the duplicity of spiritual teachers. If you are interested you will find that I have already written a good deal on both subjects, much of which is catalogued for easy reference on the website.
The following comment I recently made to a spiritualist is relevant to your current interest in spiritual matters –
PETER: Just thought I’d comment on something you said to Vineeto.
RESPONDENT: precisely how Barry Long is stating this
PETER: I know a reasonable amount about Barry Long as I followed him for a while.
Mr. Long puts his position quite clearly – he is not into eliminating ‘I’, the self but into transforming it into Self. He teachers the traditional technique of transcending the bad feelings and emotions and giving full reign to the good ones, finally achieving an illusionary ego death whereby one’s identity shifts to becoming the Good, Immortal and Divine.
A few quotes to illustrate –
... thus the alien entity, the ‘self’, merely took on a new identity to become yet another God-man – Guru of the West.
The old, ‘little self to Big-Self’ shuffle, that has ensnared genuine seekers of freedom for millennia.
The spiritual path is plainly talking about men becoming Gods, the ancient ‘escape’ from misery and sorrow – from ‘bad and Evil’ to ‘good and God’.
In the beginning it appears both the spiritual path and the path to an actual freedom are talking about the same thing until one digs a bit deeper and becomes aware of the desire to become Divine and Immortal which lies at the core of the spiritual search.
Once this is clearly seen and acknowledged, then it is only pride that prevents one from seeking a genuine actual freedom.
PETER: But to do this, to take the first step, ‘I’ have to have the courage to question all of the ‘truths’ and Ancient Wisdoms that are the very substance of ‘humanity’ and ‘my’ very bondage to ‘humanity’.
RESPONDENT: To take the first step for me was to be attentive to the urging inside telling me there was more to this life than only what I sensed and saw.
Somehow my genes remembered where I came from. This urging has been with me for my whole life. As I grew, and learned the way of the world, I felt myself going further and further away from myself. The nagging insisted. I realized I stood in my own way, which means I had become my personality. I have returned. I didn’t question any beliefs, my nagging was enough and now I have no questions and no answers other than the immense wellbeing of knowing my truth.
PETER: Another post from you. The trouble is I have to reply in words, what to do ...
Yes, I can relate to your description very well. What you are describing is the feeling of ‘coming home’, ‘realizing I am That’, ‘finding my inner peace’, ‘finding God’ etc. The terminology varies between particular religions and spiritual philosophies but all point to an ‘inner’ peace and a ‘communion’ with some form of supreme being or energy.
My experiences led me to challenge the belief in a supreme being and an after-life as well as my ‘inner’ experiences and spiritual identity – and this questioning led me inexorably to the actual world of purity and perfection, delight and innocence. And the amazing thing is, it is under my very nose as it were, all ‘I’ – both ego and soul – had to do was get out of the way. (...)
RESPONDENT: There exists nothing such as facts.
PETER: I think you are in real trouble if you say that your computer screen is not a fact and these very words you are reading are not a fact. Next you will be telling me that I am not a fact and I am but a figment of your imagination. Not even in your wildest imagination could you anticipate my response to your words. No, these words are actual given that you can see them on the screen
On my screen, they are flowing – as if by magic – from my fingers on the keyboard, right now, right here.
PETER: I can’t give you more than the sense I make of the Human Condition.
RESPONDENT: Of course you cannot, not even this. Because you can know the human condition as your condition, nothing more.
PETER: The Human Condition is common to all, as per definition. The ‘spiritual’ world is firmly within the Human Condition. Since time immemorial humans have worshipped Gods, believed in good and evil spirits.
The only difference between you and I is that I acknowledged the Human Condition in me and actively pursued its total elimination in me.
PETER to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now: Well I did butt in on your list, and I subscribed because I was told there was some discussion on the list for a while about a book I have written about my years as a Sannyasin of Osho. I have watched for some 2 months of mailings, but the quoted Osho poetry the other day inspired me to write a comment. Peter to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now
RESPONDENT: Making money on gibberish? Well, all credit goes to Osho.
PETER: No, I seriously doubt if I will make any money at all from it, only a handful have bought the book and no spiritual bookshops will stock it as it is too heretical. Pity, because I always thought the spiritual seekers might be interested but they seem too loyal to their particular Master, have too much of an ‘investment’ in time and effort, or are simply ‘hanging in’ with their particular group to even consider an alternative. (...)
RESPONDENT: What’s that? Could you help me with a simple definition?
PETER: ‘Turned my back’ means I left the normal western Christian world I had lived in and became a follower of an Eastern Spiritual Master. This involves a renunciation or turning away. Or at least it did in those days. Most people have watered their faith down a bit to fit in to normal, while the more devout continue in the old traditional ways.
RESPONDENT: Dream on (IOW, don’t mistake greed for love),
PETER: ... launched myself into this new adventure. I was particularly taken by his wisdom about Religions and the problems they cause and the fact that most wars and persecutions are the result of blindly following some particular Religious doctrine and defending or attacking others of differing belief.
The first 4 years were glorious, with the aim of a utopia in America, a city to show the world how to live. The heady days came crashing down with the internal corruptions and the external pressures from the local communities who felt threatened by the anti-Christian Devil and his followers in their midst. The threat of violence was diffused when Rajneesh left and the dream was shattered.
Then came Pune 2, and delicious years of worship in the Ashram, architect/builder for the Samadhi, meditation and groups, and then He died. I continued on devotionally for some 2 years,
RESPONDENT: Could you be more specific, what did you continue devotionally for 2 years?
PETER: The usual round of work in the West, visits to the Ashram for groups, work, meditations, and hanging out.
RESPONDENT: Finally an insight – FOLLOWING – very important insight, so let’s see what did you do after a dead Master ...
PETER: – something that was at odds with my understanding that when a Master dies the formation of a Religion is the inevitable result. Sure enough, one night in White Robe it hit me like a ton of bricks as I was shouting ‘YA-HOO’ to an empty chair.
RESPONDENT: If you looked more carefully the chair was empty from the beginning.
PETER: Well, for me the experience when he was alive was different to when he was dead, with an empty chair and an old video. Maybe no one else noticed if he was alive or dead, but I did. (...)
PETER to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now: ... that it took another year or two before I finally began to look for something fresh and new in the spiritual world and tried out a few other scenes. None was satisfactory, but I did begin to gain a broader vision of the spiritual world. Finally, I realized that the Spiritual is nothing more than Eastern Religion, that in fact I had only traded believing in Western Religion for believing in an Eastern Religion. And all of it merely ‘that Old-time Religion’, to quote from the song.
RESPONDENT: Expectations and expectations again. Think about it for a change. Think about YOUR motives. You seems like a kind of guy who prefers to buy what he wants to have, and all this fishy spiritual hocus-pocus is actually nothing for you, you buy and yet you get nothing, strange, ha?
PETER: Yes, but I believed all the fishy spiritual hocus-pocus as you put it because it was the only thing on offer at the time. I gave it 15 years of intense effort (‘Yeah, but obviously not enough!’ – I can hear the refrain.) and it didn’t work. So I gave it up and tried something different. In the physical world, if something doesn’t work after all your efforts to get it to work, you finally throw it out and find something that does work. The chief executive of an American airline summed it up when he took over an ailing airline. He tore up the company’s operation manual on the basis that, by definition, a lunatic is someone who keeps on doing something that does not work. But this sort of common sense has no place in Religion or Spirituality. Humans still wait for a God (or God-man) to ‘fix it all up’ one day, or ‘transport’ them to some imaginary ‘inner’ cosmic world, while actively contributing to the wars, persecutions, fanaticism, perversions, sexual ignorance, etc. and masquerading it as the cure!! The priests and gurus are the greatest peddlers of snake oil (charlatans) on the planet. If I had of succeeded in the spiritual world I would have merely become yet another ‘King of the psychic world’.
What I sensately experience, now, as this body, is so superior to what the Holy Ones experience in their ‘inner world of bliss’.
PETER to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now: ... the East is a chaos of poverty, pollution, overpopulation, repression for women, multitudinous worship of gods and ancient spirits, rigid class structures, theocracies, technological underdevelopment, sexual repression, corruption, etc. And yet we look to their religions as the solution to both personal, and global, peace and harmony?
The other issue for me was that I saw, despite the centuries of devotion, meditation, spiritual practice and surrender, that so few had achieved the prized goal of Enlightenment. I saw recently that a Buddhist claimed, with some pride, that only about a thousand Enlightened ones had emerged from 2,500 years of devout effort by millions of monks. This meant a success rate of 0.0001% – pretty bad odds, and confirmed in my personal experience in Sannyas and amongst Osho followers. Peter to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now
RESPONDENT: If you could just give up ...
PETER: In the end I had to admit that Spirituality was a failure for me and was as inherently flawed as all other religious pursuits.
PETER: Up until now there have only been two alternatives on offer for a human being, either to be normal and accept the world as it is
RESPONDENT: Here you go again, sorry but I have to say you are really very unintelligent. What did you do in this 15 years of ‘terrible devotion'? Have you ever, just for once actually listened to Osho? Because that’s exactly what Osho was trying to help his friends and fellow travellers with, to be ordinary, to accept the world as it is – just perfect,
PETER: There is a current fashion in spiritual jargon ’to accept that the world is as it is – just perfect.’ I couldn’t do that successfully. Firstly I had to acknowledge that I was not perfect, that malice and sorrow raged within me and the traditional antidotes of love and bliss, tolerance, pacifism, being good, were but a Band-Aid to a much deeper problem. Secondly, I see wars, poverty, rapes, murders, tortures, persecutions, domestic violence, sexual abuse, etc. still raging on the planet with no end in sight.
RESPONDENT: Now this is really, really crap, you don’t know what are you talking.
PETER: The ‘perfect world’ that the spiritual/ religious people talk of is for many a but a temporary touchdown spot on their cosmic tour of bliss (Never Born, Never Died, Just Visiting... – See you Guys...!). Or it is merely a place for us to suffer rightly in, thus earning brownie points for the after death stage. Or they trumpet doomsday, some judgement day or final annihilation of the world, or at least the humans, and only the chosen ones will survive, – at least their spirit/soul/essence will. It is amazing what stories human imagination has concocted over the millennia.
PETER to No’s 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and Here-now: The only difference between the last two is that religion promises paradise in an after-life and spiritual (eastern religion) offers a glimpse of it while ‘in the body’ and a ‘final’ release into a glorious after-life (Nirvana, etc.)
Now there is a third alternative – a new, non-spiritual, down-to-earth, actual freedom.
A freedom from the Human Condition of sorrow and malice – the freedom to be happy and harmless.
RESPONDENT: After reading until this point I see no point to read on, by now I’m certain that there is nothing worth reading. Peter, not to lose my time any longer, it was to long already, I prefer to do gibberish, and I would highly recommend it to you to. It really can help.
PETER to No 16: It’s a funny thing trying to sell a book on how to become happy and harmless, and be able to live with a woman/man in peace and harmony and equity. To not only find no takers, but a myriad of objections or nihilistic responses. Peter to No 16, 2.1.1999
RESPONDENT: There are a lot of intelligent people and you cannot fool them.
PETER: I was kidding about selling a book! It is free to read on our Web-site and deliberately so. There are too many Gurus, therapists, shamans, diviners, Healers and the like who prey on the suffering of others offering snake-oil, palliatives and platitudes. I watch in amazement as the next wave of fashion sweeps through the town I live in and the desperate fork out hundreds, even thousands of dollars, for a quick fix, a feel-good week, or to sit adoringly at the feet of the next self-proclaimed God-man. Are these the intelligent people you are talking about? I was one of those seekers only 2 years ago, the difference being I was willing to ‘dig deep’ and question the teachings itself – the whole construct that is revered as Ancient Wisdom.
PETER: I am definitely wrong with you but there are, and will be, others who welcome a sincere and ‘open’ discussion even if it steps over that sacred and holy barrier of daring to question the Teachings themselves.
RESPONDENT: What teachings are you talking about? Osho never gave any teachings, at least none that I am attached to.
PETER: There seems to be a common use of this phrase ‘attached to’ in spiritual circles that is indicative of the creation of a ‘watcher’ – another identity who watches and is not ‘attached to’ what is actually observed with the senses, what is actually written, said or felt.
Hence one is not concerned with, interested in, or effected by what is actually happening – one remains merely watching and observing. Many take it to the point whereby, when they feel sad or angry (sorrow and malice) they are not ‘attached to’ it or merely watch it. This they then wrongly interpret as ‘being aware’. Merely to remain a dis-embodied, uninterested and unattached ‘watcher’ is to cop-out of the act of being an aware , senate, reflective flesh and blood human -fully involved in the act of living.
For me the awareness sparked by continuously asking myself, each moment again, the question ‘How am I experiencing this moment of being alive?’ left no room or possibility of remaining a dis-embodied and unattached watcher.
I became vitally interested, then fascinated, then obsessed with any thoughts, feelings and actions that prevented my happiness in this, the only moment that I can experience. This, of course, assumes that ones intent is to be happy in this moment – a rash assumption I know.
RESPONDENT: Peter wrote – among lots of other stuff: blah, blah, blah, ...
... blah, blah ...
I don’t get it... Spiritual as compared to everyday/mundane? Being spiritual equals a state of denial/ renunciation/ escape????? Where do you get this stuff???
I can be totally meditative while I go to the market or even watch a movie on TV... and I can certainly be quite mundane while sitting ‘trying to be (or better yet appearing to be) in meditation...
And what makes you think that if I am totally immersed in a dance therefore making it a meditation... that I am renouncing or trying to escape anything???
I think your dictionary definitions and your trying to be deep about a fairly non-complex issue, such as being in H&N is a little above my head... (thankfully)
PETER: The denial and renunciation of the spiritual path (Eastern Religions) is evident in the exalted position of the Gurus and Sannyasins in the East. Sexual repression and ignorance abounds, repression of women is notorious, rampant poverty and disease is the direct result of turning away from the benefit of intelligent thinking and resulting technological advances, and the famed compassion in practice necessitates a higher, holier position to those for whom one feels compassion towards. The Dalai Lama is venerated as the re-incarnation of ‘the Lord who looks down with compassion on the world of sentient beings’. These are the facts of what 3,000 years of spirituality have produced, compared with the blind faith in what might be possible, one day ... if only ....
RESPONDENT: So, you finally got the chop. Chalk up another victory for the little people.
PETER: Yes, indeed. Not too long ago we would have been stoned to death outside the temple gates, or hauled from our beds in the middle of the night by hooded men. Mostly this went on as a way of silencing dissent, but it also gave a chance for a few to vent their spleen and anger – nothing like a good old lynching to make one feel really good. As for another victory for the ‘little people’, it really is another victory for God and his earthly representatives – the spiritual Masters. Their demand for love, devotion and loyalty, together with their followers eager willingness to love, trust and surrender has created an atmosphere that makes questioning the teachings and the teachers all but impossible.
As such within the spiritual world peace is an impossibility – never has been and never will be possible. Quite the contrary – blind obedience, love and loyalty are a potent recipe for arrogance, conflict and ignorance to flourish. One puts blinkers on to the extent of being willing to kill or be killed to defend the ‘cause’ – in this case the ‘love’ and honour of someone long dead. I am curious as to why anyone would continue to suffer on the spiritual path, given that there is now an alternative on offer, and continue to inflict suffering on others who do not share one’s own particular love for one’s own particular God.
It is fascinating as an outsider to see the mastications within the spiritual group to which I used to belong, the bewildered attempts to make any sense of the heritage left by an Enlightened Master. The futile attempts to put into practice the inane teachings such that any semblance of peace and harmony ensues within the group... If one looks with open eyes at the teachings one sees that this ‘love’ is the core – the ultimate sacrifice – demanded by Him as membership of the group. All else is but a sop for the gullible. The fall-back position of ‘love’ and devotion for Him, sets in concrete the formation of His religion.
Yet another generation, yet another religion. Hence yet another sectarian separation, conflict, religious war, persecution, discrimination, silencing, ostracizing ... on and on and on.
But the end is nigh for both Eastern and Western religions. Life on the planet is simply getting too good, too easy, too comfortable for many and it is those people who will begin to challenge the Ancient Wisdom that insists that life is meant to be about suffering and sorrow and fighting and standing up for one’s right to be malicious. It is those people who will seek a genuine and actual freedom – those who will refuse to settle for second best.
PETER: Hi everybody,
Well, as the subject said I’m sitting back and taking stock of things. It has been a couple of weeks now, of what often seems an endless list of objections to what I am saying.
I mused back to the time I first came across Richard and tried to remember what my reactions were at the time. I am looking for some yardstick in order to compare and maybe offer some words to anyone who is interested. When I first met Richard I was full on in the Spiritual world looking for freedom from the ‘shackles’ I felt that stopped me living fully. I naturally assumed that what he was talking about was spiritual in nature and as I had a chance to talk to him personally of his experiences of Enlightenment, I leapt at the chance.
Then the shit began to hit the fan as I realised he was not talking of Enlightenment but of something far more radical – the total annihilation of the ‘self’. I remember at one stage it dawned on me what I was in for – the end of ‘me’. I thought, what happens if this thing works? The end of ‘me’! But I had vowed to find a way to free myself of the ‘shackles’, I had determined some 10 years previously to find the ‘meaning of life’ as I stood by the coffin of my 13 year old son. So the offer to become happy and harmless was too good to pass up whatever the cost. And I had decided that the whole spiritual game and spiritual world was increasingly weird. But it took a good deal of bloody-mindedness and intent to get out of the meta-physical world and to even consider that there was an actual world, a world outside of imagination.
When I propositioned Vineeto about investigating the possibility of living together in peace and harmony, she was still firmly in Sannyas and for some 6 months we agreed not to talk about the ‘war’, as we put it. But seeing the success of ruthlessly questioning all beliefs around gender, sex, relationships, love, etc., she eventually became interested and was able to question her spiritual beliefs, love and loyalty, surrender and trust.
So I do appreciate that it is difficult – such is the all-encompassing belief in a Something or Someone Else, and all I am saying is, to anyone who has any doubts that the spiritual path might not be delivering the goods for you – my experience is this works. It is radically, 180 degrees in the other direction, in the physical world there is no God, guru, Energy, Existence, Truth, Absolute, Intelligence, Spirit, Mother Nature, Afterlife, Karma, Reincarnation or whatever. I wrote in my journal of my battle with God and this is a bit from the end of that chapter.
PETER: Well, looks like it is one of those days when it’s a letter to everyone ...
Vineeto is typing one as well besides me now, so there will be a lot of words from the ‘Peter and Vineeto show’...
I do like writing to people personally, and answering questions or objections, but occasionally I like to tell a bit of my story as well, and get it out of the personal arena. The thing, of course, is that this is not anything personal that we are saying. We are talking about an actual freedom from the Human Condition, a condition that afflicts all humans This freedom is available for everyone although it is clear that not everyone will want to take it on. I wanted to give you the motive, the ignition point by telling you about the time when I really decided I would make the search for freedom the most important thing in my life. It is the first chapter in my journal for those who don’t mind a bit of reading ... who can spare the time. (see below)
The other thing I have been musing over is the curious reaction from Sannyasins to my Journal. I liked Sannyas and Sannyasins, particularly in the early days. There was a sense of pioneering, challenging the norm, giving it a boots and all approach. Now I get many people telling me ‘I’m all right’, ‘I’m watching my self’, ‘I’m happy’, ‘Life goes on and I’m going with the flow’, ‘I am already That, all I have to do is realize it’ ‘There is nothing I can do – it is all in God’s hand’s’ etc. etc. Acceptance was always an acceptance of me as I was, whereas if I was honest with myself, I wasn’t the best I could be – I wasn’t free.
That’s all – I want to keep it short, but I just wanted to say this is nothing personal, humans are all inflicted with the same disease. The scientists are starting to isolate the genes, or software, that triggers the instinctual behaviour patterns relating to fear, aggression, nurture and desire – so it is a fact. But now there is a chance to do something about it, in you.
Serendipity is operating for who-ever is reading these words ... the ‘train’ is passing by.
All you get by waiting to live fully ... is more waiting.
RESPONDENT: As for your notion that the experiment failed, I see no possible way you could know that, as the experiment continues even if it is only with me.
PETER: I have written in detail of my experiences and why the spiritual path failed not only for me but for millions of others down the ages, but you stubbornly refuse to want to read anything of my story. What you do with your life is your business, after all, it is your life. I say that as a fact. And it is so perfect that it is that way. I am simply offering an alternative for anyone who has doubts about the spiritual path, its workings and its results.
RESPONDENT: Are you covering up your feelings of failing by projecting them on to everyone else? Does this help you to feel less?
PETER: No. I have spent some18 months ridding myself of the feelings such that the need to either repress them or express them ever comes up. I can’t tell you how good it is to be free of the remorseless and fickle emotional churnings and thoughts generated by a sense of ‘self’.
RESPONDENT: For the rest of your discourse, sales pitch, what ever it is... you certainly make being a Sannyasin...no you never said Sannyasin, did you? You make being a Rajneeshee sound repulsive and I guess being one could be! (depending on the dreamer)
PETER: Being a follower or believer in Osho is no more or less ‘repulsive’ than believing in any other God or God-man. The major trouble with believing in Gods is that people gather in groups to do it and then fight each other as to whose God is speaking the Truth, who is Right, who is the Best, who is the Only God, and this results in all the religious wars, persecutions, repressions, moralities, superiorities, etc. So my comments are not personally directed at Osho or Sannyasins, but are about the whole spiritual world. It is just that I spent 15 years with Rajneesh, so I know that particular version very well.
RESPONDENT: Now had you tried sannyas perhaps you’d be having a different story.
PETER: Well I only tried it for about 15 years, some must be clocking up 25 or more by now. Have you tried longer, or are you intending to get Enlightened soon? Do you have a time frame?
RESPONDENT: These comments do not feel like they are coming from a content man that is no longer malicious. (Which is a interesting catch phrase common to your and Vineeto’s posts. Does its use become dogmatic?)
PETER: It’s just that no one seems to worry that we humans all fight each other and live in fear of each other. No-one seems to care. I do find it strange.
RESPONDENT: So you did whatever you did for 15 years... What is the significance of comparing it with some who may have been 25 years or whatever I have been doing?? As I see it, this comparison does not follow logic. What about the millions of people who have never been Rajneeshees or Sannyasins. Do they then become the wise one by your equation and reasoning?
PETER: I have told you of my aims in being a Sannyasin, have written of my experiences and now put it out so others can abuse me freely because I have dared to question the Sacred beliefs and Ancient wisdom. I am always curious as to what others are searching for, do they have any aims in life, and if they are searching do they have a time frame or seek specific results and changes in themselves. The other curious thing that happens is because I ‘dare’ to question the existence of God, then I am seen as being either a Guru or a Devil. And this is despite the fact that I firmly state that Gods, Gurus, Devils and Demons dwell only in the passionate domain of human imagination. That it is all a gigantic fairy-tale, only made ‘real’ by the re-telling for millennia.
RESPONDENT: Here you also missed the comparing of being a Rajneeshee and a Sannyasin. You talk as though they are the same thing. But they are two distinctly different words. For me I found there to be a great difference between the two as I have been both. (currently, I function as a individual) But being a Rajneeshee is one who does as instructed, no responsibility, a drone, worker, whose value is found in being a part of the overall unit. Rajneeshees are who built the ranch.
PETER: I take it you weren’t at Rajneeshpuram. That was the time that Rajneesh first began to establish the religion with the name Rajneeshees.
RESPONDENT: Being a Sannyasin for me was/is about making choices. And the choices are taking personal responsibility or avoiding personal responsibility. Both are the available options, and still there are no guarantees of outcomes regardless of one’s choices.
PETER: So does this mean that it doesn’t matter what one does, it is all right anyway. I read a bit of Ramesh Balsekar the other day and he said it didn’t matter if you killed someone as it would have been God’s will anyway. I truck with none of this. I enjoy freely and sensibly exercising my will – no God’s will operates in this body.
PETER: I see you have been taking a peek at my mails before deleting them. I don’t expect you to agree with what I am saying at all but I welcome your scrutiny.
RESPONDENT: So Peter-Peter...
Your endless posts have worn me down. Here I am attempting another response to the ‘words’. (I’ll call them just words, as I can’t find any useful and productive words to describe them that would not be overly mean & ugly...) I find that I start reading Vineeto’s and your posts... and you both start out actually addressing the person you are writing to... making a connection... but after a few lines you fall back into your robot rap... I-me-Richard – alternative-we-great-experiencers – here-save-world-bla,bla... and I then go click-delete. But this last post to No 27 you didn’t wait long at all before demonstrating your projections.
PETER to No 27: Yes indeed, and it is a thing I make no apologies for. Millions, if not billions, have assiduously practiced their methods, sat in their presence, and gave their lives in loving gratitude and humiliation for nil result – except for a tiny few who get ‘it’ and then get to become the ones to whom others then practice their methods, sit in their presence, and give their lives in gratitude and humiliation ... Peter, List C, No 27, 9.1.1999
RESPONDENT: You seem to build your whole rap on speculations and projections. Then from there spin off into the clouds with your new found way to be. But if you start with building on delusions where can you end but with anything but delusions??
Millions? Billions? give their lives? for nil?? just speculation and projection. As far as I am concerned...these people devoted what they wished, learned what they learned, and went on to live long productive peaceful loving ordinary lives... maybe some didn’t. So what!
PETER: ‘Millions, if not billions’ is a reference to all the devotees of Eastern spirituality (Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism, Shintoism, Taoism, Zen, etc.) in all the thousands of years, many, many of whom spent their lives secluded in monasteries or ashrams (in Tibet, Japan, Thailand, Cambodia, Korea, India etc.) or devoting hours of their days in meditation, ‘watching’, praying, or the like. The recent influx and western interest in spirituality is but a ‘blimp’ on the vast sweep of history. The point of my statement was that once this became evident to me I was able to put my position in perspective. The failure rate of producing profound individual awakenings (Enlightenment) of the Eastern religions became startlingly evident, as did my arrogance in assuming that I could do any better. The other issue was that despite (or because of) the numbers, sincerity and effort of all these people the countries had appalling levels of poverty, disease, corruption, repression of women, and often downright theocracies. I fail to see this as speculation and projection. A study of history and an open-eyed visit to the East will still confirm this to be the case in many countries.
RESPONDENT: But I’ll take a stab at an explanation of my point:
I is not a singular pronoun. It is a collective pronoun. It is THE collective pronoun. The only I is the I we are. Present-centred consciousness is the God-realized activity of Self. I’m wanting to avoid esoteric sentences. That last one was too far out. We never find God because we look for God outside ourselves or in ourselves and God is neither outside or inside but is the us. Never mind. I won’t go on. Maybe I’ve provoked something for us to talk about.
PETER: The spiritual, esoteric world leads to much confusion and it is best not to try and make sense out of it. In fact one is extolled to leave one’s ‘mind’ – (and common sense unfortunately) at the door of the satsang hall. A definition of spirit-ual from the dictionary might be useful –
–– The animating or life-giving principle in humans and animals. This as a disembodied and separate entity, esp. regarded as surviving after death; a soul. A supernatural, immaterial, rational or intelligent being, as an angel, demon, fairy, etc. The divine nature or essential power of God, regarded as a creative, animating, or inspiring influence. Oxford Dictionary
Peter: Spirit is the basis of the word spiritual and yet many spiritual people, when asked, somehow manage to deny that they believe in spirits or that a spirit lives within them which will be going ‘somewhere’ – after physical death. Religious and spiritual leaders are but the representatives of the good spirits on earth or practice the cultivating of a good spirit within themselves that will then go to the place where all good spirits go. Of course, the good spirits are there to counteract the bad or evil spirits which are deemed to make human beings violent, murderous and sadistic. All this is a gigantic play of the imagination resulting from ancient mythical interpretations.
We now know that the ‘evil’ of malice and sorrow is simply an instinctual programming of fear and aggression instilled in all human beings by blind nature in order to ensure the survival of the species The elimination of this ‘evil’ can now be taken out of the hands of priests, gurus and imaginary Gods and put where firmly it belongs. It is now up to each of us to eliminate instinctual fear and aggressions from within ourselves – and with it the complimentary so-called good instincts of nurture and desire.
Those who present themselves as the spokesman and representatives of the forces of ‘good’ are going to put up a hell of a struggle, such is their vested interest in keeping everyone miserable and dependant. The lure of an Actual Freedom from malice and sorrow will eventually win out for there is nought but purity and perfection, delight and fascination in the experiencing of the actual world. The Actual Freedom Trust Library
There was a book I read recently called ‘Hell-bent for Enlightenment’ and I bought a copy as it was about someone’s personal search for freedom from the Human Condition. When I read the book I was fascinated to see that her ‘Enlightenment’ would occur next year upon death and then she would ‘drop out and go back to where I came from’. It struck me again that this is nothing more than the Heaven I thought such a silly idea as a kid.
RESPONDENT: The path of the devotee is a reality to many, and my perception is that probably just as many reach this way as any other. AND, I agree that most don’t awaken.
PETER: If by reach you mean become Enlightened, the figure I have heard quoted is 0.0001% of devotees. Ken Wilber in ‘What is Enlightenment’ magazine
RESPONDENT: But so what? What’s your problem with the world AS IT IS?
PETER: Well for me it hit me like a ton of bricks one day when I realised that the spiritual path is not a new thing – millions if not billions of Easterners have painstakingly and diligently practiced meditation, witnessing, watching, retreating from the real world, etc. for thousands of years with so few ‘reaching’ and no tangible, actual change in the the Human Condition for the rest – humans are still firmly in the grip of malice and sorrow. The problem with the world AS IT IS is that humans still fight horrendous wars 160,000,000 killed in wars this century alone and the proffered hallowed solutions are a mere fantasy escape from this reality.
RESPONDENT: When I was in the first stages of awakening, as perhaps you are,
PETER: No, I have had a few of these awakenings and there was still a ‘me’ there, except I became a Grand ‘ME’ – I was Love, Existence and I were one and the same.
RESPONDENT: I was trying to convince everyone of what I saw as the truth.
PETER: I never got that far as I realized that if I kept on with pursuing my ‘awakenings’ that I would end up Enlightened and it was happening at a time that I was starting to have more than a few reservations about Enlightenment as a career path. In short, I didn’t like their lifestyles, I didn’t like how they were with their women, and I didn’t like the whole worship, God-men bit. I’m not being facetious, as you probably see it – it is how I saw it. It was at the time when I was deciding what I wanted to do with my life, and when I met Richard and he said you can become happy and harmless, actually free of any malice and sorrow whatsoever, in the market place, on earth, right now, right here – I took up the offer – and it worked.
RESPONDENT: I was in a way right, but I was trying to change the world. This arrogance is actually hurtful as it is not accepting.
PETER: Yes, it is such a strong instinctual pull to go for the Glamour, Glory and Glitz of being the Saviour of mankind. I battled with it for months on the path to Actual Freedom and I wrote about it in my journal, the God chapter, if you are interested.
As for change the world – their are 5.8 billion people currently and what an impossible task. I turned it around 180 degrees and focused my entire efforts and energies on changing me – the only one I could change and the only one I was vitally interested in. After all I have to live my life, if I am not happy now, then I have something to look at, something to do, something to dig in to, something to change. I made my being happy and harmless the most important thing in my life. As for accepting others the other remarkable thing is that I now like my fellow human beings, I neither fear them or feel aggression towards them. I wish them well in life. And I offer my experiences and expertise, with neither humility nor arrogance, to anybody who writes to me.
RESPONDENT: I began to realize that people awaken in their time, that learning only happens thru living, and there are no shortcuts.
PETER: As I said, others are not my concern as to what they do with their lives, my happiness depends on no one else. But if someone writes I am delighted to talk of my favourite subjects.
RESPONDENT: When you really get Osho, you get the joke ... that seriousness is the problem.
PETER: I just decided as nothing else was working after 17 years on the spiritual path I would give something else a whirl. Sincere, honest, obsessed, serious – yes, at the time since it was my life and my happiness I was concerned.
These days its not at all serious, this business of being a human being. I just need to make sure I have enough money for my simple needs – rent, food, and a computer mainly. I sold my car and bought a computer thinking it would be cheaper, but hmmm...
Each day I awake, knowing I will have a perfect day and knowing that the only essential thing is to eat. A sense of well being that is palpable is my constant experience, on top of which I get to do cute things like write to you.
PETER to No 15: So, unlike the other metaphysical and philosophical theories of freedom this one works and delivers and, as such, easily rebuffs charlatans and frauds. The proof is in the actual and in my experience if you can prove an end to malice and sorrow in equitable one-on-one companionship you have ‘put your money where your mouth is’. There is no greater test of fire than sexual freedom and equity, than for man and woman to live together in utter peace and harmony – not in theory but in practice.
The Gurus have failed to deliver, they have had their day. The old ancient, long dead ones have eschewed morals and ethical precepts for their followers who have fought horrendous wars as to the Rightness of their masters or own particular God’s vision. And as for the modern Gurus, I know them well to be pretenders. I have seen the despair that ravages their private lives and those around them. The chaos and duplicity of their personal lives, their sexuality, their treatment of women, the psychic powers and the entrapment, surrender and eventual total emotional dependency and enslavement of their disciples is but a sad useless re-run of all that has gone before. No wonder the spiritual or religious pursuits require bucket-loads of faith, trust and hope – it is needed in the face of its continual failure to produce the goods – peace on earth.
What I am saying to you is that Enlightenment is finished, now that Richard has exposed it from the ‘inside’. Discipleship and the Spiritual Path are also finished and Vineeto and I have exposed the fraud that it is nothing other than Eastern Religion masquerading in sheep’s clothing. So maybe, just maybe, it is worth while considering that everybody (including yourself) has got it 180 degrees wrong. Not just a bit wrong, but all wrong.
It can be an enormous blow to pride, particularly male pride – I know it was for me – but I am immensely pleased I let go of the ‘tried and failed’. I did however have to acknowledge I was neither happy nor harmless in order to even begin to become free of the crippling Wisdom of the Past. And then I got to be a pioneer on the path to actual freedom and I always liked to do a bit of pioneering occasionally, to dare to be authentic and original is such a hoot.
RESPONDENT: Yes, but what’s not a fact is that a teaching is a failure because carnage has not been stopped. Understanding of a teaching can’t be pushed down peoples throats. They have to do it themselves. A master or teacher can’t force himself on people. He offers an opportunity to understand, but many people unable to console themselves with third rate concepts, after all it’s easier, with all trouble you mentioned as a result, yes.
PETER: Okay, here is another idea you can deny or object to. I’ve got an endless supply, by the way. So let’s say there have been about 10 billion human beings who have walked the planet since cave-man times. Let’s say there have been about 1,000 masters or ‘good-quality teachers’ who have known and not merely pretended. My guess is that there have been at least 1 billion who have given the teachings a ‘fair go’ in their lives. They may not have realized the Truth but they have sincerely tried their best to live by the teachings. And yet, we humans still fight and kill each other. There is not even a semblance of hope that peace and harmony is possible on the planet.
So what you are saying is that the 1,000 teachers are right and the 1 billion followers are wrong.
This is only a suggestion, but maybe, just maybe, you might consider, if only for a second or two, that the ... teachings could be wrong?
PETER: There is usually a clap of thunder and a flash of lightning and that’s that. End of discussion.
So, Ancient Wisdom is the Wisdom of Humanity – the set of ‘rules’ how it is to be a human being on the planet.
The mother of all Wisdom is ‘you can’t change Human Nature’. When I met Richard he said ‘Of course you can! Why not?’
I liked that ... Why not indeed!
RESPONDENT: That’s not my understanding. But if a human wants to change its nature a set of rules is fine. One has to start somewhere. Intelligence will find its way.
PETER: No, the essential requirement of the ‘set of rules’ on the spiritual path is to leave one’s intelligence and further to surrender one’s will to God. One is doubly doomed. Intelligence is thwarted by the call to trust and unquestioning faith and the demand of surrender, devotion and loyalty enslave one for the term of one’s natural life. A high price to pay for the hope of a mythical after-life. The only benefits in this life is the feeling of being one of the chosen few – one gets to feel sorry for those not especially chosen or those who are backing the wrong horse in following a lesser or false God. For this insanity one sells one’s freedom, denies one’s intelligence and surrenders ‘lock, stock and barrel’. To surrender is to admit defeat to the possibility of living, on this earth, as a flesh and blood human being – and this act of surrender inherently requires an enormous faith in an after-life – one is trapped in a vicious circle.
RESPONDENT: As for Sannyas, I’ve never been into believing in God; as a matter of fact, Osho repeatedly said God doesn’t exist.
PETER: I know many discourses where he talks of God, Oneness, Divine, Sacred, Holy, Nirvana, Love, Being, Buddha Nature etc. The use of words with capital letters in all his writings and books is a clear indication of God or the Divine in whatever form or description. The Eastern spiritual tradition is not monotheist like most Western spiritualism and, as such, God is a slippery concept, and deliberately so.
RESPONDENT: Yes, slippery, like a bar of soap one desperately tries to grasp when taking a shower. Don’t know why you insist on talking about God. There is no God, for Christ’s sake!
PETER: I keep forgetting that for Sannyasins now Rajneesh is God, not merely the Master ‘who’s finger points to the moon’. He is the moon, hence the shift in Sannyas from seeking enlightenment and freedom to grateful prayer, worship and devotional servitude to Him. I wrote a bit in my journal of the time when it first became apparent to me that Rajneesh was God and Sannyas was a Religion –
Methinks you have your own God and happily dismiss anyone else’s God – a common form of slipperiness well used in the spiritual world.
PETER: Whichever way you look at it, both Eastern and Western Spirituality clearly indicate a ‘something else’ or ‘somewhere else’ apart from this physical universe
RESPONDENT: Well to try to uphold that the universe is only physical leads to absurdities when one uses common sense. Sooner or later you will have to invent some or other God, a physical one of course. The concept of a universe as being only physical is as slippery as the concept of a God...
PETER: Many people have already resorted to bestowing Godly qualities or energies on the physical universe – anthropomorphism abounds, hence the term Universe with a capital U. Anyone of spiritual conviction is so far from having the ability to apply common sense that for them to even use the term leaves me gasping in incredulity. Common sense or native intelligence only begin to come into play when the human brain is freed of the absurdities and restrictive covenants applied by believing Ancient Wisdom. Then, and only then, can one look at the bulk of the social identity, and only then one can explore the core instinctual emotions. By developing a firm and self-convincing spiritual identity on top of an already enveloping social conditioning one has gone even further away from both common sense and the senses of the physical body. The denial of the body and the mind evidenced by such Wisdoms as ‘you are not the body/mind’ confirm this non-sensical retreat. It is a long and rocky road back to the senses and to common sense – it is the greatest challenge facing Humanity at this time and it is the personal journey of a life-time to accept the challenge. That the physical universe is not a concept is easily demonstrated by putting gaffer tape over your mouth, holding your nose and waiting 10 minutes. As you rip the tape from your mouth, gulping air you may well begin to consider that the physical universe is a fact for you, not just a concept. As for the slippery concept of God, this conversation stands testimony to that fact.
PETER: To call a spade a spade – it’s all God ... be it by any other name ... a ‘something else’ or ‘somewhere else’ apart from this physical universe.
RESPONDENT: Part of the human condition is this eternal duality: some say the universe is all physical, some say it is all God. I don’t take sides... To take sides is to get stuck in the mud...
PETER: This is the ‘one foot in each world’-philosophy upheld by many. It equates to ‘I’ll get on as best I can in the real world and I’ll sprinkle a bit of religion to keep up my ‘brownie points’ for the after-life’. The eternal duality that you talk of is the battle between good and bad, God and the Devil, Sacred and profane. As such, anyone who leaves the en-trapment of the spirit-ual world of good, God and Sacred can only be seen as going towards the bad, the Devil and profane. But, of course, there are no Devils, there are no Demons in the actual world. They exist only in the heads of those who believe in them. The Actual world is benign, benevolent, abundant, opulent, ambrosial – a literal sensual paradise, both infinite and eternal. And all happening, here, now. As for ‘one foot in each world’ – step out of both worlds, leave your ‘self’ – and ‘Self’ – behind and step into the actual world.
PETER: The belief in an after-life is exactly what prevents human beings from being here on the planet, now at this moment, as a flesh and blood only human being. Each human has a soul, or psychic entity that ‘feels’ separate and alien, and wants to desperately believe in an after-life. This ‘me’, usually evidenced as fear, is aware that the flesh and blood body will inevitably die and therefore ‘my’ only chance of surviving is to believe in an afterlife or seek Divinity and Immortality.
RESPONDENT: I have enjoyed your writings. But only one thing has been questionable to me. Its about being disciple of Osho. As far as I have understood, you seem to had been a disciple of him to get something, Enlightenment, actual freedom, or anything you can call. It sounds a kind of bargain to me. It is very strange compared with my experience of being a disciple of him.
PETER: Yes, I am starting to wonder myself what people become a disciple of a Master for? What is it that they are seeking – if anything at all?
When I said I was seeking peace and freedom I was howled down.
When I said it was a New Man – peace on earth – I was similarly scorned.
And yet when I ask anyone why they are a disciple the silence is deafening – it as though I have asked some very strange question that they have never ever thought about. I know that when I took Sannyas I was pretty much ‘going with the flow’ and it was at a stage when it became apparent what an awful place the ‘real’ world was.
It was only the death of my 13 year old son, that shook me out of my lethargy and set me searching for freedom from the ‘shackles’ that I could feel bound me. And I wanted to be free – as this flesh and blood body – before I died. The sight of the dead body of one so young and so close to me gave me both the intent and the sense of urgency to ‘get off my butt’ and to not stop searching until I found.
A month later, I was watching Rajneesh’s body burning down by the river, and ‘more shit hit the fan’ – I knew I was on my own ... my Master was dead.
Still, I hung in out of loyalty, love and gratitude, but I could also see the religion forming all too clearly. I got a glimpse of the absurdity of it all one night while shouting Ya-Hoo to an empty chair, with thousands of others dressed in long white robes – ‘Is this what my life has come to?’
Despite this glimpse of sanity it still took me another 2 years to swallow my pride and admit I was in a religion.
By the way, my dictionary defines a disciple as ... ‘an adherent of the doctrines of another; a follower’ – Macquarie
RESPONDENT: You are now OK. Its good. But I think being disciple of Osho is not what you have experienced while you were a Rajneeshee.
PETER: Well, in the ‘good old days’ we renounced the ‘real’ world, joined the commune, donned orange robes, wore a mala, and ‘worshipped’ 10 or so hours a day.
There seems to be a milder more laid-back ‘Meditation Club’ type disciple emerging these days. Fair enough, the ‘serious’ approach really ended when the Ranch folded.
‘Aye ... it’s not like it was in the old days’ ... Oops ... I’m starting to sound a bit like the ‘old boys’ talking about the ranch days in the corner at some Sannyasin gathering.
No, look, I haven’t got a problem at all with your objection to what I say being based on questioning my ‘disciplehood’.
I’m ‘OK’ now, as you put it, precisely because I questioned my disciplehood, and the facts I discovered were a shattering blow to my pride.
For me, it’s just so unbelievably good not to need to follow, to need to trust, to need to have faith, or to need to believe ... to be free of all that is an amazing experience, to be free of the ‘shackles’ I felt when I stood by my son’s coffin.
PETER: Ah, the affectations and feelings in full flight, seductive as ever. Ever promising and ever failing to deliver except in fleeting glimpses, unless by supreme effort (usually suffering) one becomes fully deluded into feeling glory and awe. ‘Thine own true nature’ is of course to realise that one is ‘timeless, never-ending, always has been, always will be’
It is an enormous construct that has been built up over millennia and as such is not at all easy to begin to question let alone see through in it’s entirety. The only guide is the peak experience, or Pure Consciousness Experience (PCE), when one is able to directly experience the perfection and purity of the physical universe free of any ‘self’ whatsoever, free of a personal ‘self’ and free of the ‘Grand Self’. We tend not to recall these experiences or re-interpret them later as spiritual experiences, such is the instinctual cunning of the ‘self’ to remain in existence.
A Self is, after all still, a self, merely in a grander form, and a deluded one at that, as ‘it’ then believes it is immortal and will survive after physical death of the ‘body/mind’.
Everybody has got it 180 degrees wrong – such is the overwhelming power both of wishful thinking and passionate feelings.
RESPONDENT: This will be your new name, Swami Anand Deleeto. Will it be difficult to pronounce? Anand means Bliss and Deleeto means clean, wiped away. The bliss of wiping away.
PETER: Hi Anand Deleeto, I see that No 27 has just freshly initiated you into the world of Sannyas.
You don’t know me at all but I thought I would write to you as a fellow human being to offer you a couple of Web addresses if you want some facts about the spiritual world you are in and information on a new, non-spiritual down-to-earth Actual Freedom.
I wish you well with your new life, but if you find it isn’t working, that you still have doubts, that you still feel something is missing, I offer Richard’s web-site and the Peter and Vineeto web-site.
You will probably hear on the grapevine that we are disgruntled ex-Sannyasins with a grudge, the ‘terrible twins’, or that we didn’t ‘get it’, or that we are flogging some rival version of the Truth. That we are pretending it is ‘something new’ when it isn’t Really – the usual stuff.
It’s just an offer, something to check out, if you are interested.
And just a comment on No 27’s words to you after your initiation – but only if your interested, Deleeto ...
RESPONDENT: This will be your new name, Swami Anand Deleeto. Will it be difficult to pronounce? Anand means Bliss and Deleeto means clean, wiped away. The bliss of wiping away.
PETER: Ah, yes. The feeling of leaving the ‘normal’ world behind – to take on a new name, a new identity and a new role – the spiritual seeker – and to join a commune of fellow seekers. The Club.
RESPONDENT: It is such a bliss to silence the endless stream of words. Sometimes one has to do it again and again because the words keep coming. The words are so alluring, perhaps I am missing something, one thinks. So one stops a bit and looks and listens, but after a while one sees that it is only a repetition.
PETER: Ah, Anand Deleeto. I see here that Sw. No 27 is alluding to silencing the ‘endless stream of words’ from the actual world, from this very computer. He is advising you that it is boring repetition, and not to get trapped in it. But I guess if you bother to wade through the words you will make your own evaluation. I just like it that there is now an alternative to the ‘Tried and True’ spiritual path. I would also point out that the Tried and True is the ‘Tried and Failed’ in that it has been persuade by millions, if billions of people for millennia with only .0001% achieving Enlightenment and the countless religious wars, cleansings, perversions persecutions, tortures and repressions are the inevitable result of the whole spiritual – i.e. spirit-based – belief system.
RESPONDENT: The mind can only endlessly repeat thousand year old arguments. There is nothing new under the sun. It is all a futile exercise like moving furniture around in an empty room.
PETER: Anand Deleeto, here he is obviously referring to the Ancient texts and myths. Indeed within the spiritual world there is nothing new under the sun. Rajneesh himself talked endlessly about all sorts of Masters and all sorts of other religions and teachings and was a master at telling old myths, stories and legends
What I am talking of is outside of the spirit-ual world. You see, I am an atheist – I live in the actual world where Good Spirits and Evil Spirits, Gods or Demons simply do not exist. They are but a collective fantasy of the psychic world. These Spirits or ‘energies’ – all generated in the psyche by a fear ridden ‘I’ do not actually exist.
So, No. 27 has told you, there can be nothing new under the sun and that this is the best we human beings can expect. To be born into a world where everyone is fighting and squabbling and you end up doing it yourself because ‘this is the way it is’. And there is a ‘reward’ for our suffering ... we simply turn away, go inside and imagine there is a ‘somewhere’ better or a ‘someone’ who is looking after me. Surely there has got to be something better under the sun, and there is. An actual freedom from sorrow and malice is now available if you are interested.
RESPONDENT: Slowly, slowly one gains courage. Be brave, Anand Deleeto, trust your intuition. It was not there before, it is not there now. Dare to wipe away and enjoy the bliss.
PETER: On the spiritual path, Deleeto, you will be admonished to leave your mind at the door, surrender your will, and trust your feelings. You will be encouraged to sit silently and go within to encourage a stilling of personal thoughts in order to begin to feel Bliss and Oneness. In short, you will give full reign to your feelings and emotions. ‘You’ who you feel you are will become grander and grander, bigger and bigger, and if you really work hard at it, one day – POP! ... you will realize that you are GOD!
So if you trust your intuition, trust your feelings – you are but doing a wonderful job in keeping your ‘self’ in existence – from ‘self’ to ‘Self’.
For me, I knew my ‘self’ was the problem and eventually saw that to blow it up in self-aggrandizement was to be going 180 degrees in the wrong direction.
But this is just what I have found. You will obviously make your own observations and judgements as to what you do with your life-time on earth.
It has been nice to drop you a line (... or a post, as it is these days), Deleeto.
It was really just to give you a couple of sites to check out if you are ever interested, and have the time ... but then I got off on one of my raves again.
But then again, if you are true to your name, you won’t even be reading this, but maybe someone else will, and maybe they will be intrigued.
PETER: All of the major philosophical movements are built upon the supposed teachings of long dead wise men, pundits and philosophers. Any so-called modern wisdom.
RESPONDENT: ... you are confusing orthodoxy with realization
PETER: Realization is about as orthodox as you can get. Everybody’s doing it. The latest versions are called ‘Awakenings’ and are a bit watered down wherein one still has a few ‘personality quirks’ remaining – like anger, jealousy, sadness, depression, rage, impatience, etc.
PETER: Have you not read any religious, spiritual or philosophical books?
RESPONDENT: Certainly, I read all of them, but finally I read me...
PETER: In the spiritual books the ending is always – and then I realized I was God and God was me, or some similar version. Which is what everybody finds if they search inside. Funny that – no-one finds that they are a human being, they always find they are a God. Reminds me of past lives – not too many farmers from Burringyup.
RESPONDENT: It is timeless and always individual... always a discovery.
PETER: Always individual?
RESPONDENT: It is the discovery of ‘I am’ and thus individual... indivisible... Knowing truth means knowing there is no ‘me’ or ‘my’
PETER: I think I have read hundreds of variations on this theme from spiritual books and Gurus, but if you insist it is individual you are in good company anyway. (...)
PETER: Strange, to watch hundreds of people, sitting isolated, with their eyes closed, going inside and imagining ‘feeling connected’.
RESPONDENT: This projection of yours is at the heart of all your bullshit. It is you who is imagining that the others are imagining feeling contented.
PETER: Are you saying you don’t have a feeling of ‘feeling connected’ when you go ‘inside’? Isn’t this the point – to feel Love or Agapé? I hardly see this as a projection. Why else does one meditate? Why else does anyone seek Union?
RESPONDENT: What you do over and over is to make a false statement such as ‘Ancient wisdom is good old religion’ and then groove on your own misunderstanding. On the other hand you could be a Boring Again Christian yourself because you are so deaf and dogmatic...
PETER: To call someone a Christian seems to be the ultimate Sannyas insult.
RESPONDENT: I have nothing against Christians, some of my best friends are Christians...You are like a boring again Christian who just says their script over and over and never stops... because they are so convinced that they are right.
PETER: Given the spiritual nature of the list I am pointing out the facts about spiritualism – that it is nothing more than Eastern Religion. Given that Religion and the belief in God has, and never will, bring peace on earth – quite the contrary – I write of a new solution to the Human dilemma. How it is now possible to rid yourself of malice and sorrow, should you so desire.
What you find boring I find an extraordinary development in human history. Which is why I reply to all the objections. Maybe, just maybe, a new phrasing, a new aspect, a new fact will be the ‘crack in the door’ for anyone who is interested. (...)
PETER: To become free of the belief in good spirits and bad spirits. To break free the slavery of the Master-disciple business.
RESPONDENT: It is you who calls it slavery, that is your interpretation.
PETER: Well, the first thing asked of any disciple of a Master is to surrender to the Master. I remember in the early days of Sannyas the need to surrender was an essential requirement. One surrendered to the Master and put one’s faith and trust in Him. This is not my ‘interpretation’. I can distinctly remember the phrase ‘You are not surrendered enough ... Swami’ that was so often used in the commune.
Peter’s Text ©The Actual Freedom Trust: 1997-. All Rights Reserved.