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(List D refers to Richard’s List D
Vineeto’s Selected Correspondence Detachment and Dissociation
KUBA: I remember a while back on this forum Geoffrey wrote about which articles or bits of information he would recommend to those looking to succeed with the actualism method. He wrote (paraphrasing) that “This moment of being alive” was the key article and this along with some other bits of information would likely be enough for anyone to succeed. But he also wrote (again paraphrasing) that he saw the “Attentiveness and Sensuousness and Apperceptiveness” article as potentially problematic for various reasons. I can see how for someone like me – clearly prone to dissociation and defaulting to a meditative like focus – it has been problematic. VINEETO: Hi Kuba, Thank you for this assessment of the “Attentiveness …” article I remember once discussing the article with Richard, after 2010, when it had been online for a decade and he wondered if it better be taken off the website because many couldn’t see the difference between Buddhism and actualism when reading it. But because he had many correspondences online about the article already Richard decided it was too late. ‘Vineeto’ never took to this particular article, in contrast to all other of Richard’s writings and correspondence. But then ‘she’ also never took to Buddhistic-type meditations – ants-in-pants was the only effect it had for ‘her’. During ‘her’ years in the Rajneesh commune in Poona ‘she’ was more drawn to dancing meditations and therapy groups of the humanistic express-your-feelings variety – which was then the flavour of the decade. KUBA: And I was always fond of that article, perhaps for that specific reason, that in my misunderstanding I would begin to apply that same meditative like focus to ‘examine the psyche’. This kind of focus can be summarised by the phrase – I am not that. ‘I’ would assume the role of attentiveness and ‘I’ would direct ‘my’ gaze on all these affective phenomena, looking at them come and go and examining them one by one. This kind of looking it was quite addictive because it was safe for ‘me’, after all ‘I’ was only looking at these things which were not ‘me’, and ‘I’ could spend countless hours apparently exploring the depths of the psyche whilst remaining fundamentally unchanged. Essentially ‘I’ would assume the role of the watcher. Now writing this out I would wager that I am not the only one who has defaulted to such a thing. VINEETO: You are certainly not the only one. It is easy to overlay one’s own real-world paradigm over Richard’s writing and look for apparent similarities rather than the vital differences. As such the very first words on the Actual Freedom Trust homepage are generally brushed aside – “new”, “non-spiritual”, “down-to-earth” and of course “actual”. You can check out the tool-tip right next to the title which details this ‘derailment’ of understanding. It’s all very amusing once one recognizes where one has gone awry. KUBA: What I see now is that genuine attentiveness to the cause of diminished enjoyment and appreciation automatically leads to change, it is only by acting as a watcher that ‘I’ can remain unchanged. I have often used the following example when trying to describe to others how getting back to feeling good takes place – to remember perhaps a moment when say the weather was starting to shift and affect one’s plans, and there would be this shift happening into ‘being’ frustrated or upset or what have you, and all of a sudden this would be seen – in the most matter of fact way – as simply silly, and it would cease there and then. I think most people have experienced something akin to this happening in their life. But there is no watcher in such a scenario, it is ‘me’ that sees how silly it is to let X spoil this moment of being alive, and this seeing is the ending of that particular drama. The reason why it works is because in such a scenario ‘I’ see that ‘I’ am ‘being’ frustrated or upset and that it is simply silly to ‘be’ that – the end. It seems I am untangling now just what on earth I have been doing all this time. VINEETO: You might find Claudiu’s report interesting after Richard suggested, in reply to Claudiu’s first post to the mailing list –
After further understanding what the original Buddhism was about as compared to the watered-down contemporary versions, Claudiu reported how he slowly extracted himself from his long and intensive meditation practice –
I recommend the whole page of this correspondence from February to December 2012 as an example,
to let it sink in that there is indeed nothing in common between Buddhistic practices and actualism, nothing at all,
in fact they are 180 degrees opposite. This theoretical & practical background may help so that every temptation
to fall back into the familiar grove of distancing yourself (which habitual behaviour tends to do) will start
flashing a red light of alarm for you each time it happens. After “years spent distancing myself from
it” [resentment] KUBA: Essentially it’s slowing bringing out into the open all these feelings and states of ‘being’ which ‘I’ have pushed to the side and ignored. And of course ‘my’ ‘actualist identity’ has solidified this even further, in that I just wouldn’t accept that yes it is me that is being resentful or anxious or what have you, it couldn’t possibly be me because I am an accomplished actualist lol. But as Claudiu wrote the other day this is indeed the case – that if there is a feeling happening then it is me, no matter who I believe or assert myself to be. VINEETO: Ha, I know from ‘Vineeto’s’ experience, developing an actualist identity is nearly unavoidable, and it’s beneficial you recognized and labelled it. As Richard says –
KUBA: And often it is little things, silly things, that I would
not allow “such an accomplished actualist” would ‘be’… For example just now there was this feeling
that after I finish training BJJ today I will not have anything else to look forward too. I know this feeling because
I have felt it for a long time, except that I would experience it as coming from ‘out there’ and somehow
assaulting ‘me’. But no it is me after all, and now it makes sense experientially what Richard would often
mention – is it not silly to let such a thing spoil this only moment of being alive? Indeed it is but I first had
to see that it was me all along. VINEETO: There is a perfect remedy for pride when it looms to get in the way – a healthy sense of humour.
Cheers Vineeto
ANDREW: Hi Vineeto, To echo Adam’s theme of initial reaction to later appreciation, I took this as encouragement but didn’t specifically have anything to be courageous about. I was also surprised by the encouragement to be friendly with myself, it is always a great reminder for me. (…) VINEETO: Hi Andrew, Perhaps this is something to take note of – reminding yourself to be friendly with yourself until it becomes a beneficial habit. As your further post indicates, this reminder allowed you to feel some of the deeply buried fear and contemplate it. ANDREW: The drama in the moment of writing about the fear of failing again, has revealed more of the simplicity I look for these days, rather than any “thought out” type of conclusions based on the “story of my life”. The simplicity is the basic fear intrinsic to being a survival (and reproductive) program, at my core. It’s a feedback loop which is now focused on the fact there is a lot less potential life ahead, than there is behind, and the daily reminders from the aging process that this is not math, or theoretical. The fear, which is me, and has always been so much that a) was ever present, b) not admitted, ever. I distinctly remember the moment I vowed to myself I would not admit I was afraid even. It of course, didn’t stop me being afraid, but it means I denied it to myself so thoroughly that in many circumstances I didn’t even feel it. That moment was as a child when the stove caught on fire, an oil fire on the cook-top when someone had left oil heating up. I remember “screaming like a girl” and in that was even going to douse the flames with water, though I don’t remember what happened. I remember such shame sitting on the step out the front of the house, that I vowed that I would never be afraid again. I was about 10 years old, I think. I have of course, felt fear many, many times, but it is surprising how few, if any will I openly
admit feeling it. I probably have talked about it, in theory, but admitting, in the moment, that I am afraid, is
rare. VINEETO: This was a harsh treatment indeed for a 10-year-old, and when fear is constantly
pushed away, it automatically grows – the very affective energy of pushing it away increases the affective charge
of the unwanted feeling. And when it is seriously suppressed, over a long period of time, it results in all kinds of
psycho-somatic side-effects. For additional general information see Richard, Dissociation and Trauma So it’s very beneficial that you can now allow to acknowledge and feel the feeling of fear, as much as you dare each time, being friendly and shining the bright light of awareness and contemplative attentiveness on those feelings.
When you apply this kind of contemplation, at bit at a time, and then perhaps longer, not getting side-tracked into imaginations or intuitions, then the affective charge of fear will diminish and allow you to more deeply understand how you tick. It might well diminish the restlessness you reported. Of course, you can do that with any feeling that arises. Cheers Vineeto
ANDREW: Thanks Vineeto, I had never truly contemplated the now obvious parallel to the institutional disassociation described in the link to the AFT. Wow! VINEETO: Hi Andrew, I am pleased this article about ‘dissociation and trauma’ ANDREW: Indeed, I went for a walk this morning and that was the theme, being completely ok with feeling whatever I am actually feeling! If I am afraid, nervous, and otherwise stressed, then so be it! I need to acknowledge fully that this is all me! As Geoffrey said in his report of becoming free, that it was him, not some ‘self’ with enough quotation marks as not to really be him, but him! The one thinking and feeling right now! (Paraphrased from memory). VINEETO: Indeed, acknowledging the feeling fully, i.e. affectively, is how you find out how you are, and from there you can make a choice how you want to experience this moment of being alive – given that you do have this choice. Here is the quote you are paraphrasing –
This is the sincerity to the core where you can genuinely experience how you tick and also make the choice for action, guided by the sincere intent (willingness/ readiness) to be felicitous and innocuous, happy and harmless. ANDREW: Another little phrase I came up with “it doesn’t matter that I will most probably feel horrible or bad in the future, most probably a lot, and most probably for a long while, that doesn’t mean I have to feel bad in this moment”. This feels freeing from the ‘intellectual’ habit of giving up because it’s “all going to be taken away anyway”. Which segues into the encouragement to have courage! Anticipating pain usually means seeking to avoid it, however this imaginary pain, of ‘losing’ whatever joy or happiness I have now, shoots the baby, and tips out the bath water “just in case” I will be disappointed. VINEETO: Of course, pessimism or even cynicism are no recipe to avoid the pain of disappointment, and if I am not mistaken you have tried that for years and know it doesn’t work. What Richard suggests is something that cuts through all anticipation and disappointment –
And the tool tip next to it explains it further –
You almost said something like this yourself –
Your ““just in case” I will be disappointed” is the well-known safe-guarding against an already anticipated future from experiences in the (remembered) past, whereas when you recognize that only now is actual genuine change can and will happen. It is both simple and radical. ANDREW: I have resolved that it’s ok to feel bad, for as
long as it takes in any moment, to otherwise a) completely stop fighting myself b) take on board the simplicity of
the method; that is, it is only me who can chose what I am feeling, and I won’t be able to do that if I am busy
fighting myself. VINEETO: I do understand that you want to start where you are at and first get used to not pushing uncomfortable feelings away, to replace this habit by stopping fighting those feelings and let yourself be as you presently are – and be a friend to yourself. One step at a time. I liked how Adam-H understood what it means to “being my own best friend” –
Which means that eventually you discover that letting yourself be as you presently are, as a friend, segues into not letting yourself ruin your own day. Cheers Vineeto
VINEETO: You are very welcome. When you pay affective awareness to any diminishment of enjoying and appreciating this moment of being alive and detect a ‘good’ feeling, or a ‘bad’ feelings in reaction to some ‘good’ expectation not fulfilled, you will soon be able to identify those ‘good’ feelings which are the most cherished. I am also reminded of Geoffrey’s words again –
KUBA: I have had these words on my mind constantly – that it is the ‘good’ which keeps the ‘bad’ in place. I think this is something very crucial and I don’t think I have ever seen the full extent of what this means. Firstly it is the biggest taboo within ‘humanity’ to consider abandoning the ‘good’ (along with the ‘bad’) this is being a traitor and then some, it means to abandon everything that ‘humanity’ holds as precious. VINEETO: Hi Kuba, Whenever I read Geoffrey’s report, I understood “my precious” to be what Richard frequently describes as “what ‘I’ hold most dear”, ‘me’ the identity. However, ultimately it does not matter because Richard makes it clear in the quote I sent you 8 days ago – [Emphasis added by me]. It is those who were here before you, who instruct and viscerally pass on to every ‘newcomer to this planet’ on what is to be held ‘precious’ but it has its foundation in your, and everyone’s, genetically encoded instinctual passions. Hence it is your very nature to be living, supporting and maintaining that ultimate value. Cheers Vineeto * KUBA: Hi Vineeto, Thank you, reading and contemplating these recent posts is getting right to the nitty gritty of ‘me’, it’s like I am looking under this and that piece of rubble with this sense that the next thing I lift to look under might well result in the whole thing collapsing. And there is like a stillness that has descended all over whilst contemplating all this. Reading your recent reply has shifted my attention to the fact that it is ‘me’ in ‘my’ totality which is the “precious thing”, ‘I’ am the thing ‘I’ hold most dear, ‘I’ agree to give up ‘my’ very ‘self’ for an actual freedom to eventuate. It is certainly exhilarating and destinal to know that this is precisely what is to happen next. JAMES: This has helped me to understand what is meant by ‘my
precious’. It is the ‘I/me’ itself which we make so precious and it is nothing but a figment which is all made
up of feelings and beliefs. KUBA to James: The thing is that this “figment” is all that ‘I’ have ever known and all that ‘I’ have ever ‘been’, it is the entirety of ‘me’ and of ‘my’ life. Your assessment reduces the enormity of what is at stake for ‘me’ into something between hopeful intellectualisation and dissociation. As in let ‘me’ first create some distance from ‘myself’ and then reduce this ‘self’ placed ‘over there’ into a collection of feelings and beliefs, kept alive only because “we make it so precious”. The end result of this exercise is that ‘I’ will then try to end this mere “figment” by some kind of ‘seeing through’ etc. I know this because I have done this countless times! But the key question here is just how on earth could the above ever trigger altruism? A self-sacrificial instinct. JAMES to Kuba: Good points, I see what you mean. I have taken something with enormous consequences and made it sound like nothing. To make it trigger altruism I would have to put my all into it which I obviously haven’t done.
Thank you for confronting me with that. I now want to dismiss it which is what I have always done but you have
inspired me to look deeper. By looking deeper I see why it is called ‘my precious’ which makes it untouchable. It
would indeed take altruism to undo it as you said. It is the very thing ‘I am’. VINEETO: Hi Kuba, Hi James, This has been a very enjoyable conversation to read. This very intimacy (“I want to do it for you”) combined with the active experiencing of pure intent – the infinitely magnificent purity and perfection of the universe – can indeed lead to and invoke ‘your’ sacrificial acquiescence for the benefit of this body, that body and every body. (...) I wish you both profound enjoyment in the “exhilarating and destinal” adventure you have embarked on. Cheers Vineeto
VINEETO: These words are music to my ears. Ever since I came to this forum and had correspondence with you, I have noticed the glimmering of a spark of activated pure intent but it never quite lit up like now. This alive activated connection to pure intent when it is alive and activated needs encouraging and maintaining against a habit of a life-time sitting back and bowing out. Now you know that you need to want an actual freedom with all your ‘being’, … JAMES: Great to hear from you Vineeto. You are spot on in your assessment. There was something that Kuba said that made a difference this time. It made me also want to do it for him and for others and now I also want to do it for you. It is not just for me. It is for everybody. You are right that I have a life-time habit of sitting back and bowing out. That is what I am doing now. You are also right that pure intent needs encouraging and maintaining. You have always encouraged me as you are doing now and that is very helpful. That is why I really want to do it for you. I know that establishing and maintaining a connection to pure intent is key which is what I have never done. This is what I need to do now. This is where altruism needs to come in which is what Kuba spoke of and what made me want to do it for others. This is also what Richard said in the quote you posted above which is very timely for me. VINEETO: Hi James, I am pleased you understand this vital point of altruism “what Kuba spoke of”. However before you focus solely onto this point while putting aside everything else, let me remind you how this “life-time habit of sitting back and bowing out” which I mentioned in my last post, comes about and is enabled to continue. Kuba explained it very well, having discovered and understood this trick ‘he’ had played on ‘himself’ –
You understood when you had read it but this ingrained habit of reduction as described (which most people have) is still operating. Now you have a new term – “altruism” – which you say will “undo” it all. Keep in mind that you are not repeating the same mistake as Kuba described –
Here are more details about altruism for your contemplation –
This might be encouraging as well for what you are aiming for –
JAMES: Thanks to Kuba and you I now see what I have been missing which is altruism pure and simple as Richard said. By maintaining a connection to pure intent with the help of altruism my path is clear. VINEETO: Remember that it is an active dynamic connection to pure intent, where you experience “a genuinely occurring stream of benevolence and benignity that originates in the perfect and vast stillness that is the essential character of the infinitude of the universe”. It is so delicious to experience it that you will be drawn to experience it again and again. Besides, nothing less will do the trick. You can peruse Richard’s Selected Correspondence JAMES: Thank you Vineeto for the help you have given me all these years. VINEETO: You are very welcome, James. Cheers Vineeto
Freedom from the Human Condition – Happy and Harmless Vineeto’s & Richard’s Text ©The Actual
Freedom Trust: 1997-. All Rights Reserved.
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