Actual Freedom – Audio-Taped Dialogues

Q: Its lovely to see relaxed people. And it is so nice to be nice. But is there anything that you are worried about?

Q(1): I sometimes think that I couldn’t operate like this. It’s an idea of: ‘How could I?’

Q: Well let’s try it out. Why don’t you make a pot of coffee? See how you function then. That would be scientific proof now wouldn’t it? It’s the best proof. An empirical experience.

People become suspicious of niceness. The moment it gets really nice ... in a family, children get at the other child, niggling and stirring and everybody is agitated ... and people are so afraid of being nice with each other, being nice back. They become incredibly suspicious ... they become so suspicious of each other. People become so suspicious of me. They are actually accusing ... all the time ... to me ... that is my experience. That was the hardest thing, because it’s unjust. Unjustly accusing me.

Q(1): What did they accuse you of?

Q: What they accuse me of – and that was a fact – was when I would expose them. I would expose them when they would say, for example: ‘I am happy’. If I go by their own words – and it’s my impression – they are always complaining. I can only come to the conclusion that they are not happy. And the facts prove it. And they would accuse me of exposing them. It was not me, it was their own words – their own facts – because I only go by the words they use ... they complain! Either about their job or they whinge about their relationship ... they say they are bored or they wish they were somewhere else than here. Then I can only see that they are not happy here ... otherwise they have no reason to go somewhere else. When you are comfortable – we are all really like cats – you stay comfortable. When you become uncomfortable you start looking for something else to do ... or you shift in your chair. It’s that simple. It’s such an easy way to live.

As a child I wanted to be able to sit and do nothing without being uncomfortable. Now I can. I just enjoy life as-it-is. I have achieved that. It is so good to be able to say that. Mission achieved. I am sitting back and enjoying the show ... I’m already not under control; I don’t know what’s going to happen next, but it’s going to be good.

Q(1): I say to people: ‘I’m reaping what I’ve sown’.

Q: And its about time too, after all that you been doing. Every person should be happy. You put a lot of work into your self ... and then you can retire. What I see now is that it’s all coming at me. However, in the past I would pursue ... you know, I saw something passing ... ‘Oh, I really like that’ ... ‘I will go for that’ ... ‘I will get that’ ... and I got it. It was a lot of effort with all the scheming and dreaming ... and all the manipulation. Because it wouldn’t come easy ... and now whatever happens ... it’s all coming at me. I’m not arranging my life in order to be happy, it’s just happening of itself. And with it fall away all the years where it didn’t work out.

Q(1): All the past?

Q: All the past. I would try this, I would try that. ‘Will this work, will that work?’ I lived in hope: ‘Oh this relationship will work!’. ‘No, this relationship will work!’. But it would not work, again. Then I started to discover how to make it work and now it’s: ‘How could it not possibly work?’ I can’t sit back and do nothing if something is not working out properly. Once you have organised your life, then anything can happen ... or everything happens. Whatever you have ever wished for can come true. Unless you sabotage it. You are the only person who can make you unhappy. It looks like other people are doing it to you all the time, but that is not true. It is actually you, yourself.

Q(1): You blame other people.

Q: Yes. You expect things of other people that they just cannot give you. I don’t expect anything of anyone, anymore. In my environment I can have the communication that I’ve always wanted. It is so good to be together; talking about what ever we wish to talk about ... without having to hold back, like: ‘I better not talk about that’. Or: ‘Oh, she doesn’t like that ...’.or ‘He doesn’t like this ...’. Then I might as well not talk about it. Who are you kidding? If that’s the life you want to lead; forever compromising yourself ... so what? The other person couldn’t care less about your compromises. They take them for granted. They think that they can change you to fit their idea of what you should be. Yet you are not even appreciated for your compromises. You lead a mediocre life. And who wants to live like that?

That’s what I got from other people. They could be so lethargic – so accepting – about how they were. How many times I’ve been told: ‘Don’t wish for the Moon’. Why not? I am not wishing for the moon; I am wishing for what I can see can possibly happen. Because otherwise life is a sick joke. Why not? We are all supposed to be here on this earth, so why can’t it work? Why can’t we all be happy? Rather than saying: ‘You’ve got to get used to the status-quo’. Or: ‘This is how it’s been for five thousand years, or more’. And are we going to do it for a another five thousand years?

Both Richard and I came to this conclusion independent of each other. But we found each other ... and thank goodness that we did!

Q(1): Of course you did.

Q: How could we not? Because I always thought: ‘How could we not?’. I always thought that I would go to the end of the earth to find that man – it had to be a man, of course. I was not going to do it in a group ... and with the Masters, I would be just one of the many, many disciples ... and we would all be doing it the same way. I thought: ‘There must be another way’. And I simply could not rest until I found it. And I found it in Richard. I couldn’t do it by myself. I always knew it had to be in conjunction with another ... in a most delightful way. It was a case of: ‘Of course, it must happen’. Of course. Why not? So, if only we can take all those nasties out ... then we found that you have to take ‘The Good’ out as well. And that was a big step. That was the biggest ... there was a reluctance to let go of ‘The Good’ ... you know, the emotions. And passion ... to let go of love was simply unthinkable.

But if you find something much, much better, then the both can go; both the good and the bad. When you find something better, you simply leave the old behind ... It’s actually not a ‘giving up’ ... it’s not a sacrifice. You simply see it and move on. You simply leave it behind. I’m not silly – I see it with my own eyes. Nobody had to push me. Nobody had to say: ‘Come on’. I did it myself. It’s nonsense about that fear of the unknown; there is no need for fear at all. It’s an insult to be fearful about something so delightful as being here.

Q(1): That’s part of that spiritual world ...

Q: All those people gathered around one person ... how poor ... and how boring, all that sitting in silence. Here we are talking – and having a lot of fun – and we can be ourselves. We can say what we like We can talk about whatever. Why not? We are here on earth; nobody is higher or lower. Or more important. Here we have equity.

How about we make a pot of coffee?

Q(1): I’ll make it.