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Vineeto’s Correspondence on Mailing List C Correspondent No. 17
RESPONDENT No 10: Hello everyone, I just wondering if there is anyone on this list who is attracted to Peter and Vineeto? What is it you admire about their writing? RESPONDENT: I have enjoyed their writings and subscribed to their mailing list. They have talked with confidence. I like any kind of confidence. VINEETO: There are two options about someone being so confident as to take on a hundred objections and to talk about something so unpopular as changing yourself ...
Now I am searching for the words to describe this actuality in as concise and as accurate words as possible. I only write to trigger such an experience in whoever reads my words, to trigger maybe a peak-experience or a clear memory of it – and then you can find out for yourself – what are the facts and what are the beliefs and concepts distorting and interpreting the facts. That’s all.
RESPONDENT: I have enjoyed your writings. But only one thing has been questionable to me. Its about being disciple of Osho. As far as I have understood, you seem to had been a disciple of him to get something, Enlightenment, actual freedom, or anything you can call. It sounds a kind of bargain to me. It is very strange compared with my experience of being a disciple of him. You are now OK. It’s good. But I think being disciple of Osho is not what you have experienced while you were a Rajneeshee. RESPONDENT No 4 to No 17: Yes, I agree with you on this, that being with Osho to get something is a bargain. It becomes a search for yourself outside yourself. How can Osho, or any master, give us what we already are, what we already have? My experience of being a disciple of Osho is that he has shown me my identifications with what is not me and he has shown what it takes to loosen these identifications so that more and more space inside is left untouched by the world. In this space meditation grows. It is an ever-on-going process. VINEETO: For me it has always been clear that I went to India and became a disciple of Osho to ‘get’ something – freedom, peace, happiness, understanding of life, to be loved and to become enlightened – once I heard about it I equalled it with the goal of my search for freedom, peace and happiness. Otherwise, why should a 26 year-old woman leave a wealthy country, her respectable job, her friends and a loving family to go to India – to a country so stricken with poverty that it makes one weep every time one sees a human being, a country whose cities are so filthy that you can hardly breathe, a country run by corruption, an ancient brutal cast-system and all its devastating implications? Why should I go there, if there was not something that I hoped to get? Of course it was a bargain. I was there for very selfish reasons. I was hoping to learn something to have a better life than the one I left behind in the West. I don’t know what has attracted you, or you, to become a disciple? I am intrigued to know.
RESPONDENT: You are very energetic and mechanical. It’s for me fucking unbelievable. Energetic and Mecanicallllll??????? You both fucking mind-fuckers are like unbelievable human-like computers!!! If you are human-beings. You are beyond my imagination. I suspect there is sure to be someone who have written these Marvellous computer programs called Peter and Vineeto. I am no kidding in this part. hehehe. I am really suspecting very highly. BTW, I am fucking jealous of your descriptions of the Actual Freedom state. I wanna get it. But I don’t want to eliminate fucking egoistic selfish arrogant, harmful, full of anger and sorrows and depression and love and hate and fear and pain and boredom and darkness, doubtful, heavy, serious, believing, prejudiced, lonely, fucking full of craps of desires, relentless, tense, cowardice, ugly Ego, miserable psychological entity... In short I love my nut-mind, hehehehe. (But shit! I wanna fucking this Actual Freedom without eliminating ‘I’) (UUUUU I wanna drugs, uuuuuuuuuu UUUU Help me Osho. If you still have power after your death, secretly. uuuuuuuu). If in case of miracle you really are humans, I am really fucking surprised and exited to see and be friends of you. I wanna fucking say to my friends very proudly that I KNOW Persons like Spock really! They are not imaginary but real. I found them, I know them. I met real aliens who look very much the same as humans. My friends will be sure to envy me and many around me only frown. VINEETO: What a funny way to say ‘I don’t wanna change’. Are you from Sirius, or the Plejades or maybe the Little Prince from Antoine de Saint-Exupery, who tends his rose and his monkey-bread-tree on his faraway little planet – and now you are waiting for an other-worldly power to help you to be happy with your ego that you so excellently described? It seems to me that Peter and I are the only Earthlings here on the list, saying what a wonderful planet this can be without the shackles of the Human Condition. It would be all very amusing, if it wasn’t for the fact that people continuously fight and kill each
other. I take it that your passionate writing is in response to the book review of ‘Zen at War’ (http://www.darkzen.com/) that Reading of the extensive and systematic involvement of Zen masters and monks in war-crimes has shocked me – and I guess it has shocked you as well. Here there is another description of what humans do to humans, always calling the other one the inferior race, an animal, inhuman, heathens, fiends and dangerous enemies to justify the ferocity and cruelty that is displayed in wars, collective acts of instinctual aggression. 160 million people were killed in wars this century alone, and those 160 million include the 350,000 Chinese of Nanking, the 6 million Jews of WW II, the 800,000 German and 1.1 million Russian soldiers in Stalingrad, the 800,000 Tutus in Rwanda, the 100,000 Muslims and Serbs in Bosnia, the hundreds of thousands dead on both sides of the 40 years of Cold War and all the others that died for country, religion and ideology. Watching on TV the ongoing fighting and suffering in shocking pictures and learning about the enormous numbers of victims, I cannot turn away any more from the facts as I could years ago, I cannot invent a ‘karmic reason’ for all the suffering, or pretend it is only the fault of the leaders – it is all too obvious that these ongoing atrocities are due to the survival instincts of fear and aggression, which resides in each of us. Just feeling guilty or sorry for the people is a hopeless, useless and gutless avoidance, a ‘head in the sand’ attitude. The moment I dared to acknowledge these bare shocking facts, I had only one solution and that was to find the source of fear and aggression in me and to eradicate it in me utterly and completely. This is the only way I can make sure that I will never participate in violence, no matter what the circumstances, and that I, for one, can be a non-contributor to the pervading violence on the planet. I investigated and eliminated in myself the very source that drives human beings to be so horrendously cruel, devotionally obedient and desperately aggressive – the very survival instinct that prevents people from acknowledging and treating each other as fellow human beings. As I have said to No 1 before:
I remember you writing that you visited the City of Peace, Hiroshima. You wrote: RESPONDENT: When I walked around the Atomic Dome, I felt so much energy of peace. After the total disaster, which was the culmination of Man’s tendency of fear and fighting, Hiroshima has resurrected again. <...> I think we are now under the World War 3rd. Love and peace vs. fear and aggression. We vs. we and they. VINEETO: It is the ongoing suffering and fighting that gave me the intent to eradicate the ‘self’ which is responsible for fear and aggression. The only way to change the world is to change ourselves, individually, to become happy and harmless, freed from instinctual passions, beliefs, feelings and emotions. Nothing to fight for, nothing to suffer about, I can have peace-on-earth for myself and, as such, contribute to world-peace in the only way possible. But for that, one has to ‘self’-immolate. And nobody else can do it for you.
VINEETO: What a funny way to say ‘I don’t wanna change’. Are you from Sirius, or the Plejades or maybe the Little Prince from A. de Saint-Exupery, who tends his rose and his monkey-bread-tree on his faraway little planet – and now you are waiting for an other-worldly power to help you to be happy with your ego that you so excellently described? RESPONDENT: Yes, maybe I am Sirius-ian or Plejadian or maybe the Little Prince from Dain-Expupery! I am not sure, but if it is true, it’s Fucking cool, man, thanks Vineeto. VINEETO: It seems to me that Peter and I are the only Earthlings here on the list, saying what a wonderful planet this can be without the shackles of the Human Condition. RESPONDENT: Wow!!! So it means the rest of us are all Sirius-ian or Plejadian or maybe the Little Prince from Dain-Expupery. Mmmm too fucking cool, man. I must tell this to my friends, they are sure to envy me and the list, and the rest around me are to frown. VINEETO: This story that Peter and I are the only Earthlings was an actualist joke, pointing to the fact that everyone looks for the solution to life somewhere else than on this beautiful planet. Either it is waiting for heaven or for Nirvana, and help comes from a bodiless God or a dead spirit. Do you know the story of the Little Prince from Antoine de Saint-Exupery? This prince lived all by himself on his little planet with only one rose and one monkey-bread-tree, which he needed to guard. He went on a journey and came to earth. After he had seen enough of earth, he wanted to go home to be with his beloved rose. A poisonous snake in the dessert had to bite him, so he could die and reach home. I thought it quite a good story for the general accepted spiritual belief that life on earth is a vale of tears and one has to die to reach ‘home’ again. To make sure that home is really reached we practice dis-association from body and mind and ‘connect’ with our ‘real self’, which is ‘not the body’. According to spirituality we are to dis-identify from body and mind as the alien part of ourselves, the idea being that body and mind are the hindrance to become one with God. It has been such a relief and joy for me when I found that one can actually live here on earth, as this body, in my senses, and enjoy it too. When I found out that ego, soul, ‘self’, emotions, feelings, beliefs and instinctual passions – in short, the Human Condition – are constituting the real ‘alien entity’ in me. When I found out that this alien ‘thing’, the Human Condition, can be investigated and deleted. So, you see, people actually all behave as if they come from somewhere else or are going somewhere else, and that we only ‘visit’ this ‘alien’ physical world, while the only thing that separates us as ‘aliens’ from this perfect universe is our identity, our ‘self’. Once we eliminate the ‘self’ we can live the perfection of this magical planet, not as visiting aliens, but as sensate and reflective flesh and blood human beings. * VINEETO: It would be all very amusing, if it wasn’t for the fact that people continuously fight and kill each other. RESPONDENT: Yes, yes, Vineeto, yes!!!!! VINEETO: I take it that your passionate writing is in response the book review of ‘Zen at War’
(http://www.darkzen.com/) that RESPONDENT: I have heard about the book, and I wanna read it. I am very curious. Coz now I am learning about the Japan’s history of the W.W. II. What a shit!!! Fuck the Japanese emperor, fuck the Japanese military, fuck the Japanese politician! And fuck the Zen monks! VINEETO: I take it that you found the address on the web: http://www.teleport.com/~zennist/zenholy.htm It would be very easy, and not factual, when one simply believes that it was the fault of the emperor, the military, the politicians and the monks. It was the whole country that loved and supported the emperor, the emperor was supported by the people, the monks were trained according to a thousand year old tradition. To blame a particular individual is to miss the point entirely. War and cruelty has happened in every country, it happened in every century, in every religion. The history of humanity is a continuous history of war, of horrendous wars, of tremendous killing, cruelty and suffering. Most of the technological development happened to be able to attack and defend better and to be able to kill more efficiently. To acknowledge these facts on a global scale makes one aware of the instinctual root of all the wars. Every single human being is equipped with the basic instincts for survival – aggression, fear, nurture and desire. This includes the need to be a member of a group and the will to sacrifice for kin, country and belief. The various ethics and morals keep the lid on those drives for a while, but when it comes to war, those lids are off – the bare instincts take over and our animal nature becomes horrifically obvious. The more I became aware of those very instincts in me, the more I became determined to eliminate them in me. This is the only way peace-on-earth is possible, for me, and for everyone who wants to do it for himself or herself. * VINEETO: Reading of the extensive and systematic involvement of Zen masters and monks in war-crimes has shocked me – and I guess it has shocked you as well. Here there is another description of what humans do to humans, always calling the other one the inferior race, an animal, inhuman, heathens, fiends and dangerous enemies to justify the ferocity and cruelty that is displayed in wars, collective acts of instinctual aggression. 160 million people were killed in wars this century alone, and those 160 million include the 350,000 Chinese of Nanking, the 6 million Jews of WW II, the 800,000 German and 1.1 million Russian soldiers in Stalingrad, the 800,000 Tutus in Rwanda, the 100,000 Muslims and Serbs in Bosnia, the hundreds of thousands dead on both sides of the 40 years of Cold War and all the others that died for country, religion and ideology. RESPONDENT: As for Rwanda, have you heard their music? My friends made a Rwanda music CD recorded there. It so beautifully and deeply touches my soul, which is of course the root cause of sorrow and malice of Human kind. hehehe. If any one are interested in the CD. Please mail to me VINEETO: Music plays an important part in the manipulation of emotions. It has been used to control and manage people, to raise their passion, to bind them to their culture, to soothe them or hypnotize them. With music you can play people’s feelings like a piano and many talented leaders have used music very skilfully for their power-grazed purposes. * VINEETO: Watching on TV the ongoing fighting and suffering in shocking pictures and learning about the enormous numbers of victims, I cannot turn away any more from the facts as I could years ago, I cannot invent a ‘karmic reason’ for all the suffering, or pretend it is only the fault of the leaders – it is all too obvious that these ongoing atrocities are due to the survival instincts of fear and aggression, which resides in each of us. Just feeling guilty or sorry for the people is a hopeless, useless and gutless avoidance, a ‘head in the sand’ attitude. RESPONDENT: Yes yes, yes, Vineeto, yes. VINEETO: The moment I dared to acknowledge these bare shocking facts, I had only one solution and that was to find the source of fear and aggression in me and to eradicate it in me utterly and completely. This is the only way I can make sure that I will never participate in violence, no matter what the circumstances, and that I, for one, can be a non-contributor to the pervading violence on the planet. I investigated and eliminated in myself the very source that drives human beings to be so horrendously cruel, devotionally obedient and desperately aggressive – the very survival instinct that prevents people from acknowledging and treating each other as fellow human beings. RESPONDENT: Yes, yes, Vineeto, yes. VINEETO: Does your ‘yes, yes’ mean that you see it the same way – and want to do something about it? Does your response mean that you passionately want to eradicate the causes for war in you? Does your ‘ yes, yes’ mean that you understand the reason why human beings have been killing each other for centuries and you want to do something about it in yourself? Does it mean you want to be free of the survival instinct, of fear and aggression in you? * VINEETO: I remember you writing that you visited the City of Peace, Hiroshima. You wrote: RESPONDENT: When I walked around the Atomic Dome, I felt so much energy of peace. After the total disaster, which was the culmination of Man’s tendency of fear and fighting, Hiroshima has resurrected again. <...> I think we are now under the World War 3rd. Love and peace vs. fear and aggression. We vs. we and they. VINEETO: It is the ongoing suffering and fighting that gave me the intent to eradicate the ‘self’ responsible for fear and aggression. RESPONDENT: Yes, yes, yes!!! My friend! VINEETO: When you say ‘Yes, yes, yes!!!’, do you mean that you also would like to have nothing to fight for, and nothing to suffer about, that you would like to be free of the Human Condition in you? * VINEETO: But for that, one has to ‘self’-immolate’. Nobody else can do it for you. RESPONDENT: Mmm, but as you mentioned before, if I and the rest of the list are Sirius-ian or Plejadian or maybe the Little Prince from Dain-Expupery, how can I and the rest of all do it? Cheers and comradeship from the outer space. VINEETO: Ah, here comes the cop-out. I only used the expression ‘from outer space’ because you believe in this alien entity or soul. The conviction of having a soul alien to one’s physical body is combined with the belief in some higher forces which will solve the problems here on earth, be they God, Osho, Mother Earth, Gaia, Feng Shui, Somebody Else or some other Mysterious Energy. As long as one chooses to leave the responsibility for one’s life with those imaginary higher forces there won’t be any change. Humans have prayed to their particular Gods for millennia and shed their blood for them. How can you have peace-on-earth, in this life, now? The only way to change the world is to change ourselves, individually, to become happy and harmless, freed from instincts, beliefs, feelings and emotions. Nothing to fight for, nothing to suffer about, I can have peace-on-earth for myself and as such contribute to world-peace the only way possible. To do it, passionately and daringly.
15.2.1999 RESPONDENT: Hi Vineeto, Thanks for the reply. I join the [Actual Freedom mailing] list again. See you there! I have ordered the book Zen at War. And I passionately want to be happy and harmless.
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