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Srid Report on Mailing List D about
Prologue: VINEETO: If you still agree to use your name ‘Srid’ instead of ‘Respondent No. 1’ (as verbally discussed on the last day of your visit), I would like to receive a short note from you giving your agreement which I can then stick at the top of your report and of your correspondence pages with Richard. SRID: yes, i’m fine with using ‘srid’ instead of ‘respondent no. 1’ on the AF website. i understand that the
name would be used in the following pages, https://www.actualfreedom.com.au/directorscorrespondence/02AMatterofStyle.html
Message 14915 Re: Day 6 JON: Yesterday was our 6th day. [...] RESPONDENT No. 25 to Jon: [...] I often worry about the wretchedness of ‘me,’ but prompted by your portrayal of your experience and remembering mine while I was there, it occurs to me there is nothing to worry about as ‘I’ don’t exist in the first place! SRID: Worrying about the <insert a disparaging adjective> of ‘me’ is a self-centred experience. The key, as per Vineeto’s response to a similar concern of mine (three nights before today), is to notice that there are people, things and events outside of ‘me’. (As an aside, I find this worry to be ultimately based on self-consciousness ... self-consciousness of the fraudulent nature of the identity which, being a feature of every human being born, is nothing to be ashamed of/ worried about.) RESPONDENT No. 25 to Jon: [...] ‘I’ don’t exist in the first place! SRID: ‘I’ and ‘my’ feelings exist as an intuitive continuum of past memories and future projections, 24x7. Every feeling implicitly is made of past memories, and future projections. Thus, ‘I’ exist over time. Existentially realizing that only this moment exists seems to be the key to the seamless end of both past and future, thus identity/feelings ... but this requires 100% confidence; meanwhile, one can enjoy and appreciate by being here with all of ‘me’ on board (any objections to that are to be nipped in the bud). At least, that is how I’m doing it currently (with some objections yet to be ironed out). -srid
Message14920 Re: Day 6 SRID: At least, that is how I’m doing it currently (with some objections yet to be ironed out). (Message 14915) SRID: Although I do not feel like sending daily notes to a public list, an exception can be made for day 8. One major objection – that has been a lifetime habit – came up, and it is the habitual withdrawing and putting up of defence mechanism (especially amongst people). Anybody who have had a particularly fearful childhood for whatever reason should be able to relate to it. It is not possible to be here for longer periods (let alone become actually free) without first eliminating this habit.
Message 14930 Re: Day 6 SRID: One major objection – that has been a lifetime habit – came up, and it is the habitual withdrawing and putting up of defence mechanism (especially amongst people). Anybody who have had a particularly fearful childhood for whatever reason should be able to relate to it. It is not possible to be here for longer periods (let alone become actually free) without first eliminating this habit. More on this later. CLAUDIU: I’d love to hear more about this. I immediately recognize myself in that. Thanks for making it obvious by pointing it out! Now it’s on my radar more than it was before. RESPONDENT No. 42: Very interesting. Only just finished noticing myself avoiding people this morning! SRID: It’s great to see that you two found it relevant; it was the main reason I decided to post it. To withdraw-and-defend was so automatic in my case that I didn’t realize that it was what was happening all along. It was a major obstacle to progress in this trip. I’m ever so glad to have virtually gotten out of it, so as to proceed further. Funny thing is, when I wrote ‘More on this later’ I was expecting to write a report on some sophisticated investigation of the problem; instead it went away without much fuss. The next morning I remember feeling vulnerable as a result of no longer having withdrawing-and-defending as a mode of operandi, which I guess was quite normal (after all, vulnerability/fear was what necessitated such a habit in the first place). It took a bit of daring not to succumb back into withdrawal (the entire trip was at stake), but beyond that – no fuss. Jon and I just finished drinking coffee in the lodge kitchen while having yet another pleasant discussion. -Srid
Message 14954 Subject: a solution to dissociation (was Re: Day 12) RESPONDENT No. 42: Hi Jon, For me, this post is the bees knees. I’ve never read something so clear and instructive regarding the difference between ‘shifts’ that many have regarded as PCE/AF and the actual thing. It is just so clear thanks to you taking the time to explain how it is panning out for you. I think the AFT would do well to have the openning lines of the method read something like ‘one begins by recognising and coming to terms with the disassociation inherent in being a human being generating a social identy’ or something like that. It just is so central to all of this being understood for me now, hwo it ties together the whoel ‘real’ world from the religious to political to the personal, it is all disassociation. schitzopheria. You don’t have to be a meditator to see it either. Infact quite the opposite it would seem. I thank my lucky stars I suck at meditation now! SRID: dissociation is indeed normal in every day life (see when Richard was explaining the actualism method once again to me yesterday afternoon – i recall
Richard or Vineeto telling
me to go *fully* into the feelings; feel them fully/ thoroughly; *be* those feelings. there needs to be an acknowledgement/
acceptance first so, the solution to every day dissociation is to go fully into feelings. male actualists -Srid
Message 14955 Subject: psychic [correction: affective] vibes are real SRID: i thought i’d write a post on this [affective vibes] especially as there have recently been a discussion on vibes in this list. during the evening of day 8 (some days ago), i informed Richard that i don’t experientially see how feelings can travel from one body to another without involving cues (e.g.: body language). Richard was understandably stern in explaining psychic [correction: affective] vibes and questioning my understanding, as the whole milieu effect depends on it. yesterday i had a first-hand experiential understanding of psychic [correction: affective] vibes as i could acknowledge it while it was happening. if you have been following Jon's report, you should already know that yesterday afternoon he went through a period of disillusionment following a lunch conversation with Richard/ peter/ Vineeto. we both had decided to stroll back to the lodge and meet again for coffee about an hour later. Jon’s room is within a few walking steps from mine. i was sitting in my room, researching ‘windows mobile phones’ on my computer (that afternoon, Richard and i were talking about phones) and all of sudden i began to experience the feeling of embarrassment … specifically, embarrassed in front of the yahoo list members. for the first minute i glossed over this feeling, while being busy doing the online research, but then it caught my full attention and i remember thinking something along the lines of ‘wait, why am i feeling this embarrassment when i had not done anything to lead to it; in fact, i wasn’t even thinking/ feeling anything related to it, just doing some online research’. as there was no preceding trigger to that feeling, and it wasn’t pertaining to my experiences, it became obvious that it must be coming from someone else. i noted down the time, about 4:30pm. Jon knocked on my door at about 5:10pm and we were planning to go out for a cup of coffee. i asked him what he was feeling at around 4:30pm … and, as he was trying to recall it, i asked him ‘was it fear?’ and waited only a second to ask again specifically ‘was it embarrassment?’. he answered yes (to that effect). as we were walking to a coffee shop, i remember becoming fascinated at the whole subject of psychic vibes (how the brain does it, etc.). while having a chat about Jon's issue over coffee, i asked what the embarrassment was about (i.e., who was involved). as i sensed Jon was getting comfortable talking about the issue, i directly asked him if the embarrassment involved list members. he said yes. so not only were i feeling the feeling (embarrassment), but also the contents of it (list members)! psychic [correction: affective] vibes are indeed real, and they are quite an interesting topic in itself. (vibes also relate to altruism and ‘doing it for the benefit this body, that body, every body’, but that is a topic for another day). -srid
Message 14960 Re: psychic [correction: affective] vibes are real SRID: as there was no preceding trigger to that feeling, and it wasn’t pertaining to my experiences, it became obvious that it must be coming from someone else. RESPONDENT No. 00MP: But there were two triggers. You witnessed the events that caused Jon to feel embarrassed. You also knew that Jon was sharing his experiences candidly in public. Didn’t it occur to you earlier that Jon might be feeling embarrassed? If so, you don’t need a psychic explanation. If not, maybe what you thought was a psychic communication was really just a delayed realization on your part that Jon had been feeling embarrassed all afternoon? If you have a weak or repressed capacity for empathy or were really preoccupied at the time, it would explain why the feeling only came through much later, disconnected from its cause. This might not be correct either, but it’s just as possible. SRID: if i had prior knowledge of Jon's embarrassment, the feeling i experienced would have Jon as the subject, whereas what happened was that it was as if i was having/ the-subject-of the feeling (i.e., no different, affectively, from myself being embarrassed). if i had no prior knowledge of Jon's embarrassment, a ‘delayed realization’ (or delayed empathy) would still have Jon as the subject. perhaps this wasn’t clear in my original email, so i’ll state it explicitly once again: the feeling i experienced was in no way different, affectively, from the feeling i would normally experience in such a situation. put differently: suppose it was me who was being disillusioned instead of Jon and if i were to feel embarrassed (at being exposed to list members) later that day, it would be no different, affectively, from the vibe i experienced (and confirmed by Jon) at 4:20pm yesterday. * in #148xx [No. 00MP] had asked ‘how do [psychic vibes/currents] act at a distance without physical cues?’. Richard told me that vibes/currents don’t travel physical space (so that rules out, say, an explanation based on electromagnetic waves) as they are not actual. if they don’t exist in actuality, they can’t actually travel (all of this happens in the human psyche). as Richard would say, this is all new to human history/knowledge
Message 14983 Re: psychic [correction: affective] vibes are real SRID: i thought i’d write a post on this [affective vibes] especially as there have recently been a discussion on vibes in this list. during the evening of day 8 (some days ago), i informed Richard that i don’t experientially see how feelings can travel from one body to another without involving cues (e.g.: body language). Richard was understandably stern in explaining psychic [correction: affective] vibes and questioning my understanding, as the whole milieu effect depends on it. yesterday i had a first-hand experiential understanding of psychic [correction: affective] vibes as i could acknowledge it while it was happening. if you have been following Jon's report, you should already know that yesterday afternoon he went through a period of disillusionment following a lunch conversation with Richard/ peter/ Vineeto. we both had decided to stroll back to the lodge and meet again for coffee about an hour later. Jon’s room is within a few walking steps from mine. i was sitting in my room, researching ‘windows mobile phones’ on my computer (that afternoon, Richard and i were talking about phones) and all of sudden i began to experience the feeling of embarrassment … specifically, embarrassed in front of the yahoo list members. for the first minute i glossed over this feeling, while being busy doing the online research, but then it caught my full attention and i remember thinking something along the lines of ‘wait, why am i feeling this embarrassment when i had not done anything to lead to it; in fact, i wasn’t even thinking/ feeling anything related to it, just doing some online research’. as there was no preceding trigger to that feeling, and it wasn’t pertaining to my experiences, it became obvious that it must be coming from someone else. i noted down the time, about 4:30pm. Jon knocked on my door at about 5:10pm and we were planning to go out for a cup of coffee. i asked him what he was feeling at around 4:30pm … and, as he was trying to recall it, i asked him ‘was it fear?’ and waited only a second to ask again specifically ‘was it embarrassment?’. he answered yes (to that effect). as we were walking to a coffee shop, i remember becoming fascinated at the whole subject of psychic vibes (how the brain does it, etc.). while having a chat about jon’s issue over coffee, i asked what the embarrassment was about (i.e., who was involved). as i sensed Jon was getting comfortable talking about the issue, i directly asked him if the embarrassment involved list members. he said yes. so not only were i feeling the feeling (embarrassment), but also the contents of it (list members)! psychic [correction: affective] vibes are indeed real, and they are quite an interesting topic in itself. (vibes also relate to altruism and ‘doing it for the benefit this body, that body, every body’, but that is a topic for another day). (Message 14955) RESPONDENT No. 15: [...] It seems quite reasonable that you may have remembered something you have done, some pattern you’ve engaged in or opinion you’ve presented yourself in the past on the list that you had been given an opportunity to reflect on after your discussions with Richard and Vineeto. [...] Typically a feeling of embarrassment can go on in the background without any conscious awareness of why or how it’s happening until one applies concentration and diligently figures out how it arose. What beliefs were triggered etc, first at a surface level and then a deeper belief that was the trigger of the feeling. I think you do yourself a disservice by taking the conclusion that your feelings are not your own. It’s dangerous territory, projection. Taken as a new pattern for behaviour, you’ll start looking for psychic [correction: affective] vibes everywhere ... this is called magical thinking. Next time please take a bit more time and look back at what could have possibly triggered such a feeling during the past few hours. When a feeling is going on that you can’t explain, it’s not because it’s from someone else. It’s because it happened a while ago and the conscious thoughts associated with triggering the feeling have passed from your mind, and are forgotten for the moment. You need to trace back to remember them. The feeling just keeps going. It has its own momentum. It doesn’t need the original thought to keep going. It can pass away complete for a while and then come back at full strength at the slightest prompt. SRID: hi [No. 15], if you were to read what i wrote – ‘there was no preceding trigger to that feeling, and it wasn’t pertaining to my experiences’ – you would already know the answer to all of your i-know-what-you-experienced-better-than-you-do type of questions above. to spell it out further,
also note that it does not matter whether i had sussed out the possibility of Jon experiencing embarrassment earlier or not, as the out-of-the-blue feeling was experienced (at 4:30pm) as if i was feeling embarrassed ... even though i never recalled, let alone relived/felt, my past incidents of embarrassment. let me ask you directly: do you deny the existence of affective vibes? if not, why go into such bizarre length as to claim to
know better of what another person actually experienced? [see also Richard’s post on this topic -srid
Message 15106 Subject: Ballina trip, summary SRID: hi everyone, here is a report of the key aspects of my trip to meet Richard, peter and Vineeto (and grace); for the day to day details, refer to No. 39’s earlier messages. * the night of day 8 was a big turning point for me as that is when i pretty much put an end to the habitual withdrawing due to various childhood fears. i’ve already written about it earlier, to quote:
Basically, after the first couple of days or so and until the night of day 8, i became quite withdrawn to the point that it hampered my having fun in the company of Richard, peter, Vineeto and Jon. during this period, i once described Vineeto and Richard as ‘dangerous’; Vineeto as more so than Richard because, being closer to it, she could directly point out the human condition in me. On the night of day 8, right after washing the dishes, i mentioned my then view on affective vibes/ psychic currents to
Richard. see message 14955 for details, but basically i told him that i don’t see how vibes can happen without involving cues (body language,
vocal tone, etc.) … leading to Richard firmly – not sternly – questioning my assumption. hearing even animals noticing the lack of vibes in
Richard/Vineeto, i simply assumed that affective vibes are real and that i was desensitised to it somehow … until i had a first-hand experience
of vibes (see message 14955 the next morning i remember feeling vulnerable, which was the natural response to no longer resolving to withdrawal-and-defence as the default reaction. not much investigation involved; i simply noticed what was happening and nipped it in the bud. by end of the day i virtually stopped withdrawal and defence in response to vulnerability. vulnerability itself became a much simpler issue to individually deal with. * the opposite of feeling vulnerable is that one becomes interested in people and events happening right now. during the day we first met grace, i remember using the expression of ‘doing of what is happening’ to Richard upon noticing that there was ‘less of me’ as i was, for most part, simply being the felicitous interaction happening on the house boat. closer to the end of the trip i also confirmed that this is the direction to take in order to get to out-from-control/ different-way-of-being. * a few other things we talked about that stuck in me:
* i didn’t become actually free as per my ideal goal of the trip, but i’m ever so glad to have progressed greatly. as a result, i have a clearer understanding of ‘what needs to be done’ which is … surprise! surprise! … to enjoy and appreciate each and every moment of being alive. the goal i have in mind is to become virtually free (enjoy and appreciate 99% of the time), or at best enter out-from-control. once that is achieved, i want to become free in the company of Richard/Vineeto/peter. * what about the actually free folks themselves? before going on the trip, i didn’t harbour any doubts that they were living anything but a happy and harmless life, so i wasn’t surprised seeing them living that. anybody who is still of the opinion that ‘richard/Vineeto/peter is <insert derogatory adjective>‘ is doing nothing but wasting their own time, which could be best spent on applying the method. ‘tis amazing how much we humans can object to being happy and harmless. * it is now about a week since i returned from my trip. being with ‘normal’ people can be challenging, but that is also a great opportunity to whittle away parts of ‘me’. for example, after returning back, i was fumbling around a Big Issue (™) … until yesterday wherein i saw through the whole thing – how ‘i’ tick; basically, this particular issue is do with what people think of me (WPTOM) and what i think of them thinking of me (WITOTTOM) … ah, coining acronyms! the last 24 hours has been such fun because being virtually relieved of WPTOM/WITOTTOM leaves more room for enjoyment and appreciation. -Srid
Message 15213 Re: Trust RESPONDENT No. 42: It was fantastic to have the method available to apply to this moment; that it isn’t about getting back to a place of being able to trust, but rather enjoying and appreciating this moment of being alive; trust just isn’t needed! Now, having mostly recovered from the common cold i’ve had for a few days, and having seen the source of this self-recriminating, self-defeating , deficiency in the psyche, I feel far more able to be friendly to myself and have found a new lease of life to be able to ‘get wholly on board’ with enjoying and appreciating being alive. happy and harmless SRID: excellent! when all is said and done, in the end, the actualism method comes down to enjoyment and appreciation as an ongoing experience in life. the more and more one enjoys and appreciates each moment again – the more and more an affective awareness of the same becomes second nature – the easier it becomes to instantly spot any dip in enjoyment leading to automatic engagement of cognitive attentiveness so as to suss out the silliness of whatever incident which took away that felicity/ innocuity. nothing is worth losing that felicity/ innocuity over. -Srid
Message 15214 Re: Three types of mindfulness SRID: neither actualist awareness nor cognitive attentiveness is about [the flesh and blood body] realizing the delight of experiencing this moment of being alive [in a radical new view of there being an Actual World not perceived by the identity], because:
RESPONDENT No. 00Sr: That’s interesting because I thought AF was about de-empasising affect and heightening attentiveness to sensuousness. Why the emphasis on affective? Is it because ‘I’ until becoming actually free can only be genuinely attentive affectively? Presumably happiness is an affective quality but what about harmlessness? SRID: as the identity is the feelings (and vice versa), then any ‘de-emphasising’ of affect (you) can only lead to
dissociation. and ‘heightening attentiveness to sensuousness’ on top of a dissociated self (possibly dissociating from the sullen aspects of
itself) is what is referred as ‘aff’ practice (message 10915 * SRID: [...] realising that ‘I’ am ‘my’ feelings, [...] although this would increasingly become part of one’s understanding, that is not what actualist awareness or cognitive attentiveness is essentially about. RESPONDENT No. 00Sr: At the moment I’m not in a great head space and I find that a mild sullenness rather than a feeling of mirth is my default state. Realising ‘I’ am my feelings seems to help. SRID: in what way does realizing ‘i’ am my feelings seem to help? does it help put an end to that mild sullenness so as to recommence another period of enjoyment and appreciation? RESPONDENT No. 00Sr: It is a embryonic realisation but seems to me an important one. On the other hand I can’t be sure that having my focus and concepts and focus all wrong. What do you suggest I do srid? SRID: i suggest that you practice the actualism method as advertised. here’s a handy link for you, * SRID: no, the key is an *affective* awareness; to enjoy and appreciate this moment of being alive, the only moment one is ever alive, *is* the actualism method. nipping it the bud, getting back to feeling good, etc. are all *techniques* to pull oneself back into the track. RESPONDENT No. 00Sr: Got it. SRID: ok, though you don’t seem to get it fully, because ... RESPONDENT No. 00Sr: I had an experience recently that made it all to apparent to me that I was going to die. For a while I was in a funk about it. But the corollary is realising how precious time/this moment is. By worrying about shit and not paying attention to the delight of the ever present moment I’m missing out. SRID: if one is ‘paying attention to the delight of the ever present moment’ all the while worrying about shit, feeling sullen in the background, then one is dissociating (aff) – the attentive aspect of ‘me’ dissociates from the shitty/sullen aspects of ‘me’ – rather than practicing actualism. notice how you have already phrased the aff practice in two different ways:
now compare it to some of the sentences used to describe the actualism method:
as you say that a mild sullenness is currently your default state, you may find it more productive to first come to a state
of feeling good (a general sense of well-being) or even feeling neutral, before looking into why you feel sullen; here is another handy link for
you, -Srid
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