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Vineeto’s Correspondence Correspondent No 12
VINEETO: Great to hear from you. And great to hear that you had what you yourself could classify as a PCE. RESPONDENT: How much visual imagination do you use these days? VINEETO: I don’t think there is very much of it happening. Sometimes when I try to visualize certain events to come or certain things to take a particular shape I notice that I have trouble to do so unless it is a straightforward deduction based on current circumstances or present objects. Even my fears, when they occur, don’t have much visualization of what could happen, it’s more an amorphous worry until I am able to pinpoint the exact reason for it. RESPONDENT: Are feelings connected to the visual circuitry directly? VINEETO: You mean physically? I don’t know. I know experientially that visualization was far more active when my life was run by my feelings and I had some direct observations that feelings would fuel the visualization of say, a fear, a desire, a sexual fantasy. RESPONDENT: Could it be that the entity is due to the sensory domination of the ‘eye’? VINEETO: No. It seems that most people’s primary sensory orientation is visual but then there is a certain number of people who are primarily auditory and/or digital oriented, some people who are primarily tactile in their perception and a smaller number of people who are primarily smell and taste-oriented as their primary sensory orientation. This is a physical orientation at its origin and it seems that then ‘I’ build this orientation into my identity just like ‘I’ build any other physical orientation like gender, sexual orientation, physical abilities or disabilities, and so on into my identity. RESPONDENT: Could you give me an idea of how it is like in Byron Bay? VINEETO: Byron is a very small town that has developed into a holiday resort for both Australians and backpackers. It has also become famous in the last wave of ‘sea-change’ for metropolitans who want to move out of the city into a place on the beach and therefore both rental and property prices have soared. The benefits of Byron being a holiday town are that many people are more carefree – being on holiday – and there is quite an international atmosphere with all the backpackers about. Byron has therefore many more coffee shops and restaurants than a town with similar population. In winter Byron is more quiet whereas during holiday season the town is packed with tourists and I usually avoided town for those periods. Byron is also a fashionable hotspot for all kinds of spiritually infused peoples of all
persuasions, particularly the Eastern spiritualist varieties and the latest fashion of environmentalism/ animism/ Mother Earth
cultism. It is also – as Richard described it once – ‘notorious virtually world-wide for its over-representation of
health quacks and nutrition ninnies’ ( To complete the picture let me add that the Byron area has one of the highest unemployment rates in Australia as apart from the hospitality industry and some other related businesses there are some internet-based enterprises but not a great deal of industry. RESPONDENT: Do you guys meet each other frequently? VINEETO: Richard, Peter and I meet quite frequently for a chat, and/or a meal and some pleasure excursions. RESPONDENT: Party? VINEETO: No. RESPONDENT: How big is your/ Richard’s/ Peter’s social circle? VINEETO: For someone to be part of my social circle – apart from the social interactions I have with my business clients – I need to have something in common with them in order for both to enjoy each other’s company. As you can probably guess, not many people share my or Peter’s or Richard’s interest in an actual freedom from the human condition. RESPONDENT: Just curious… I know that it is personal and private… but having been associated with the list and the people, I am curious how it is to live there. Because I am living in USA right now, and when my contract ends here, I thought I should check out Australia… and why not Byron Bay etc. VINEETO: As I mentioned above, it would probably be necessary/ sensible to sort out the employment situation as Byron is not the best spot for earning one’s living unless your work is independent from where you live. Byron’s climate is very pleasantly subtropical with warm winters and not too hot summers, and its lush vegetation and picturesque hills close to the sea make it a very pretty spots on the planet that persuaded me to settle down in the area about 12 years ago.
RESPONDENT: Great to get a mail from you. No, I haven’t skipped Australia… my India trip has been getting postponed. I am much eager to visit Byron Bay on the following trip to India. In the meantime, life is going on, challenging and learning all the time. I have been digging quite a bit into the subconscious and finding a lot of ‘self-defeating behaviors/ beliefs’ and it has been very interesting. VINEETO: It’s great, isn’t it, when one finds such ‘self-defeating behaviors/ beliefs’ as then there is a choice not to continue with these, then obviously, silly patterns, that although they may have fulfilled a purpose in the past, no longer make sense. I remember that sometimes I thought with actualism I was in an ongoing course of hitting myself on the head saying ‘duuh, … why didn’t I see that before’ – because once I saw through some ‘self-defeating behaviors/ beliefs’ they no longer made any sense. RESPONDENT: I am very excited about the possibility of having a chat in person! VINEETO: I’m looking very much forward to meeting you too and having a life chat with you. RESPONDENT: How are things with you? VINEETO: Oh, life is very easy nowadays and being half-retired, or partially un-employed, as it is usually called, I have plenty of time for leisure time and doings virtually nothing. Presently I enjoy trips with Peter and sometimes others on the nearby creeks and rivers with our little dinghy with picnic backpack and everything, reading old novels from Agatha Christie, playing adventure computer games or such like but I equally enjoy the social interactions and mind-engaging activities connected with my bookkeeping work. Life has become very, very simple when hardly no emotional stress interferes with the sensate enjoyment of being alive.
VINEETO: It’s great, isn’t it, when one finds such ‘self-defeating behaviors/beliefs’ as then there is a choice not to continue with these, then obviously, silly patterns, that although they may have fulfilled a purpose in the past, no longer make sense. I remember that sometimes I thought with actualism I was in an ongoing course of hitting myself on the head saying ‘duuh, … why didn’t I see that before’ – because once I saw through some ‘self-defeating behaviors/beliefs’ they no longer made any sense. RESPONDENT: I find that the ‘me’ has a tendency to intellectually agree to all that makes sense but deeply inside refusing to change; the ‘intellectual agreeing’ is just a ploy not to agree deeply so as to bring about the change. Once I figured out this trait in ‘me’, I repeatedly insisted that ‘I’ change … what am I waiting for? This extra step seems to be required for the ‘actualization’ of the ‘realization’ … VINEETO: Oh yes, very much so, else one stops at the first (necessary) step and only revels in the grand feeling of realization with no actual consequence. Some realizations, I remember were so powerful and so surprising that change happened instantaneously but very often what is required is changing a deeply ingrained habit of thinking and feeling in a certain patterns – to catch oneself each time when this habit wants to repeat itself. RESPONDENT: Noting further, the ‘me’ in a low voice says ‘I agree but…’ and some kind of self-talk is required to expose the resistance in the form of ‘but’ and the non-sense behind it. Once all is exposed, the suffering in the form of guilt or any other negative feeling disappears. It seems to be reasonably long lasting… however there still maybe unexposed tricks and tactics and buts. VINEETO: I found that when *all* is exposed in connection to one issue the disappearance of this issue is not only ‘reasonably long-lasting’ but for good. There are, of course, other issues that can then come to the surface and cause me to stop feeling good and then these in turn need to be exposed. RESPONDENT: I wonder how all this got into ‘me’. VINEETO: Ah, but this is asking the wrong way round. Every sentient being is born with a set of instinctual passions which in humans, us being capable of being self-conscious, forms itself into a ‘self’, an entity who resides in everyone’s flesh-and-blood body from the very beginning, by default, so to speak. To understand the nature of ‘me’ and why we are inflicted with the survival passions and the ‘self’-perpetuating entity I began to look at how inanimate matter, animate matter, sentient matter and finally human beings work – how all things and beings are all essentially made of the same stuff and how we all follow the same basic principles of life. In its most primitive form animate life – even the inanimate elements do so – consists of two functions – attraction and repulsion and scientists have observed this behaviour in microbes, single cell creatures up to more complex life forms. As living things become more complex so does their reaction to their environment until we arrive at warm-blooded sentient creatures (mammals in particular), which are endowed with very much the same set of instinctual survival patterns as human beings. When you follow the ladder of evolution from the most primitive to the more complex you can see that life could not happen in any other way – this is the way life on this planet developed and the instinctual passions are vital in this chain of development in order to ensure the survival of each species and as such benefit all the other species that rely with their survival on the existence of those particular species. Human beings are in a special position in that they have the additional capability to be aware of themselves, of their thoughts and feelings. This capability of being conscious that I exist gives rise to a more complex function of the survival instincts – the ‘self’. This ‘self’ is in a continuous automatic feedback-loop focused on its own survival interests which naturally and inevitably makes ‘me’ not only very cunning but self-centred, self-perpetuating, self-oriented (as well as species-oriented). However, human beings have also developed a brain capable of common sense, intelligence and apperception – the ability to be aware of being aware … which is where actualism comes into play. * VINEETO: Life has become very, very simple when hardly any emotional stress interferes with the sensate enjoyment of being alive. RESPONDENT: Hope to get there. I have acquired a bunch of books on a variety of topics at a low cost in a recent book fair… looking forward to peruse them and learn a couple of things. My physical health is not that good and I plan to do some simple things like biking and walking to set it right. Haven’t done nature exploring much… should add that to the list. VINEETO: I recommend focusing on sensual and sensuous perception as much as you can – it is particularly delicious when exploring nature. RESPONDENT: I might still not be at ease regarding the everyday mundane repetitive tasks and once I start enjoying even those, I would think that I have changed for good. VINEETO: Part of being able to enjoy ‘everyday mundane repetitive tasks’ for me was to have a close look at what was really necessary. For instance I decided to reduce my overheads in order to be able to sell less of my time for money. Having adjusted the balance of my time as compared to ‘their’ time it was then much easier to enjoy the time I had to sell for money and the fact that when I do my work well this in itself is a satisfying activity helped in enjoying the process of it. The other thing with ‘everyday mundane repetitive tasks’ was that I had to look at some underlying resentments – as if someone else was making me do those task and not that I had in fact chosen the situation where those tasks were a necessary part of my life. For instance, what’s the point of objecting to having to wash the dishes when I clearly made the choice that I prefer to eat from clean dishes rather than have last night’s dinner still on them? Once I am aware, and am able to determine, that all I do is in fact my own choice, if possible my deliberate choice, then any resentment goes out the window. And without resentment any task can be a joy, a sensate pleasure or a mental challenge to do, if only I apply enough attentiveness to all that is involved in accomplishing it. * RESPONDENT: I read ‘Osho: The God that Failed’ by Hugh Milne and learned a few interesting things that went on in the movement. He and a few others unquestionably seem to suggest that there is this ‘aura’ or ‘presence’ in people like Osho that made even the westerners with a scientific/skeptical bent of mind lulled into this kind of stuff. VINEETO: Oh yes, there certainly was a rather powerful aura with Rajneesh as is with every genuinely enlightened person. They emanate Love and Compassion and people flock around them to lap it up and in turn give the guru devotional love, material goods and the power to mould their lives. Similarly, non-enlightened people can emanate some or a lot of charisma which then seduces others to follow the charismatic person’s suggestions, as you can see happening in the political arena, in sports and games, in religious movements or in any other group-and-leader activity. RESPONDENT: Perhaps this is the psychic web or the vibe that has been discussed to some extent in the topica list. VINEETO: It certainly is part of it, yes. RESPONDENT: Have you felt that yourself in any encounter with anybody? VINEETO: Of course. I was a very devoted disciple of Rajneesh for many years until a couple of years after his death. RESPONDENT: What kind of phenomenon is that? Is it a willing protocol buried in the subconscious of the Guru and the Disciple – coming to the surface? Or is there some kind of mysterious transmission in the ethereal space? VINEETO: Following a charismatic leader or wanting to lead willing followers is part and parcel of the human condition. I am somewhat reminded of the genetic setup of ants or bees who are born to act as is best for the survival of the tribe. In the case of humans there are other aspects, the lust for power on the side of the leader and the fear of standing on one’s own feet on the side of the follower. There is also the longing for the grand feeling of belonging to a powerful group, to be one with a crowd under one common theme, the sense of unity with others under one aim. Have you never experienced feelings like these? Those ‘transmissions’ not so mysterious after all – they consist of feelings being transmitted and received between humans and the more unconscious but strongly felt the transmissions the more powerful they are. RESPONDENT: Do these kind of things puzzle you anymore? VINEETO: No, I have thoroughly felt and understood them – what sometimes puzzles me is that people do not desire to become free from their grip. * RESPONDENT: How is Richard doing? VINEETO: He is excellent. For more details you might want to ask him directly. RESPONDENT: One of these days I should pick up Richard’s Journal/Peter’s Journal and the web site and re-read all the stuff. I may be in a better position to understand them now! VINEETO: Oh yes, personal experiences make a big difference to understanding what Richard and Peter are talking about in their journals. I can also recommend the Actual Freedom Trust screen saver, as I am enjoying it very much myself. It’s part of the DVDs that you bought. Richard’s words are nicely spaced to give time to take them in and think about them while the moving images and sounds behind the words give sensate pleasure to your eyes and ears. It’s been a pleasure to chat. Be well.
RESPONDENT: I might still not be at ease regarding the everyday mundane repetitive tasks and once I start enjoying even those, I would think that I have changed for good. VINEETO: Part of being able to enjoy ‘everyday mundane repetitive tasks’ for me was to have a close look at what was really necessary. For instance I decided to reduce my overheads in order to be able to sell less of my time for money. Having adjusted the balance of my time as compared to ‘their’ time it was then much easier to enjoy the time I had to sell for money and the fact that when I do my work well this in itself is a satisfying activity helped in enjoying the process of it. The other thing with ‘everyday mundane repetitive tasks’ was that I had to look at some underlying resentments – as if someone else was making me do those task and not that I had in fact chosen the situation where those tasks were a necessary part of my life. For instance, what’s the point of objecting to having to wash the dishes when I clearly made the choice that I prefer to eat from clean dishes rather than have last night’s dinner still on them? Once I am aware, and am able to determine, that all I do is in fact my own choice, if possible my deliberate choice, then any resentment goes out the window. And without resentment any task can be a joy, a sensate pleasure or a mental challenge to do, if only I apply enough attentiveness to all that is involved in accomplishing it. RESPONDENT: I clearly see the sense behind your approach… but I still have the ‘resentment’. The feeling inside me refuses to go away… the silliness expresses itself as postponement and switching to more enjoyable tasks. Most of it is gone but still something is left. I have some task to do which is not all that bad but still I seem to prefer reading a book and reflecting about things rather than doing the task at hand. I am not sure how to get rid of this basic resentment. Any more tips on this aspect would be welcome. VINEETO: You are aware, are you, that you make a choice, each moment again, to hang onto the resentment in favour of taking on the challenge of enjoying the task at hand? Nobody said that becoming actually or virtually free from malice and sorrow (resentment being a facet of sorrow) was effortless and on the way personal sacrifices have to be made in order to achieve your goal. Your resentment is one of those sacrifices required. Courage!
RESPONDENT: I clearly see the sense behind your approach… but I still have the ‘resentment’. The feeling inside me refuses to go away… the silliness expresses itself as postponement and switching to more enjoyable tasks. Most of it is gone but still something is left. I have some task to do which is not all that bad but still I seem to prefer reading a book and reflecting about things rather than doing the task at hand. I am not sure how to get rid of this basic resentment. Any more tips on this aspect would be welcome. VINEETO: You are aware, are you, that you make a choice, each moment again, to hang onto the resentment in favour of taking on the challenge of enjoying the task at hand? Nobody said that becoming actually or virtually free from malice and sorrow (resentment being a facet of sorrow) and on the way personal sacrifices have to be made in order to achieve your goal. Your resentment is one of those sacrifices required. RESPONDENT: Yes I got it. I need to let go of the grip of these instinctual patterns I have learnt and which is ME. Courage to proceed to the new goal – sufficient desire for the goal. I am willing to do it. Sacrifice all the negative emotions to achieve the goal. VINEETO: Yes, and the way to do it is one at a time. I am reminded of something Peter wrote in his journal –
RESPONDENT: I know – positive emotions too – but I haven’t hit that hurdle yet. VINEETO: With increasing attentiveness you will discover that good emotions are just the flip-side of the bad emotions – the same set of instinctual survival passions in action. Haven’t you noticed how easily love can turn to hate, positive expectations into disillusionment, a desire for something into fear of failure or aggressive disappointment, and so on. Often when I wanted to get to the root of one particular issue of unhappiness I had to also look at the underlying good emotion, for instance my fear of questioning/ abandoning the Sannyas-beliefs was rooted in my feelings of loyalty and love to the master and the security of belonging to his tribe. * VINEETO: Courage! RESPONDENT: IT MAKES SENSE! IT MAKES SENSE! Sense makes Sense! I am courageous enough (or shall muster that stuff) to be guided by sense. VINEETO: Once something made sense to me, I found that I hardly needed any courage – it was simply obvious that I wouldn’t continue doing something silly once I’ve seen its silliness. The courage I needed was to own up to the particular feeling I had in the situation (when I was not happy) instead of distancing myself from my feelings as I had been taught in spiritualism. In each of these situations I need to recognize that I *am* my feelings and admit that I am actively clinging to the particular feeling – then my intelligence helps me recognize that clinging to the unhappy feeling is simply silly and not worth continuing.
VINEETO: The courage I needed was to own up to the particular feeling I had in the situation (when I was not happy) instead of distancing myself from my feelings as I had been taught in spiritualism. In each of these situations I need to recognize that I *am* my feelings and admit that I am actively clinging to the particular feeling – then my intelligence helps me recognize that clinging to the unhappy feeling is simply silly and not worth continuing. RESPONDENT: I follow. Particularly with the negative feelings! I saw that I might be clinging to my negative feelings such as depression, helplessness because they offer me a way out from the risk of action and participation and failures! Once I say that it was easy to stop the non-sense that has repeated for over 12 years! The paradox is no more – why the depression kept repeating. VINEETO: I once had a period of depression and faithful to my then spiritual and therapeutic beliefs I thought I had to go deeply into the depression in order to get through it and out the other end. For months I kept crying and moaning and feeling depressed, had sharings and private sessions and still there was no end in sight. Finally after about 6 months of indulging deeply in all the feelings of depression I had enough. I was simply sick of being depressed and finally noticed that to be depressed was a waste of my life. I stopped giving those dark feelings any juice and substance and got on with my life. Of course with actualism one no longer needs to go deeply into one’s feelings of depression in order to realize that being depressed is a waste of one’s time – one can become aware of this fact right here and now. Such realization turns depression into any other habit one decides to quit – ongoing attentiveness will help you catch yourself slipping back into the old ways and swish, you are back on the wide and wondrous path. RESPONDENT: I am discovering that there is a (false) belief behind all the strong feelings. Even with the instinct, once I discover the belief (or a distortion) it makes it easy to correct it! VINEETO: Nevertheless, instinctual passions are primary – they are fully functioning before a child even has developed the mental capacity to harbour beliefs, concepts or a philosophy. RESPONDENT: Now that I am not objecting much, reading the af website archives is so informative, fun! VINEETO: Ah, I am happy to hear it is of use and enjoyment to you.
VINEETO: I once had a period of depression and faithful to my then spiritual and therapeutic beliefs I thought I had to go deeply into the depression in order to get through it and out the other end. For months I kept crying and moaning and feeling depressed, had sharings and private sessions and still there was no end in sight. Finally after about 6 months of indulging deeply in all the feelings of depression I had enough. I was simply sick of being depressed and finally noticed that to be depressed was a waste of my life. I stopped giving those dark feelings any juice and substance and got on with my life. Of course with actualism one no longer needs to go deeply into one’s feelings of depression in order to realize that being depressed is a waste of one’s time – one can become aware of this fact right here and now. Such realization turns depression into any other habit one decides to quit – ongoing attentiveness will help you catch yourself slipping back into the old ways and swish, you are back on the wide and wondrous path. RESPONDENT: Have you had experiences of going in cycles? Like you accept that it doesn’t make sense, later you are not so sure. A lot of things are clear to me. And some feeling comes and attaches to me, things become muddy again. I am no more the same person who saw things clearly a minute ago, and suddenly I have changed tunes. It seems to be the silliest – but I can’t figure out what is going on. VINEETO: Richard has a saying for certain situations – that ‘it must be a feeling, because it doesn’t make sense’. Whenever something seems silly you can be sure there is a feeling, or a whole set of feelings, at the bottom of it. I remember feeling similar to what you described – seeing things clearly and suddenly I noticed that ‘I have changed tunes’. For me it was the feeling of doubt that sent me going round in circles over and over until I could catch it while it was happening and in the becoming aware of it I could decide not to follow that path any more. After all, doubt is but the flipside of belief and to get rid of doubt I had to abandon belief, faith and trust as well. Here is one instance I wrote about at the time –
You may find some more hints in the selected correspondence * RESPONDENT: I am discovering that there is a (false) belief behind all the strong feelings. Even with the instinct, once I discover the belief (or a distortion) it makes it easy to correct it! VINEETO: Nevertheless, instinctual passions are primary – they are fully functioning before a child even has developed the mental capacity to harbour beliefs, concepts or a philosophy. RESPONDENT: Okay. I would like to re-state that there is a distortion of the fact that happens with the instinct (or with any feeling)… no? VINEETO: The reason I emphasized that instinctual passions are primary and emotional thoughts are secondary is because I am well aware that there are schools of thought, particularly prevalent in the East and now taking a strong foothold in the West, that being/having an identity is merely a belief and the solution would be to stop believing in one’s identity. This is not the case. The identity arises out of the instinctual passions that every human is endowed with at birth and it takes something entirely different to non-believing or rejecting belief in order to eliminate the identity. And yes, feelings / instinctual passions will inevitably distort a fact into something more agreeable for one’s feeling being. RESPONDENT: Do you see any use in dividing the identity into conscious and unconscious? VINEETO: Yes I do. You are conscious of some parts of your identity and of some you are still unawares – the challenge is to become aware of all aspects of one’s identity in order to be able to make sensible and enjoyable choices.
RESPONDENT: You wrote – I was re-reading some of the posts and your writing to ‘me’ :) did the trick: Can you elaborate on this aspect? Can you describe it further? What is the aliveness, magic you are talking about?
RESPONDENT: Thanks a lot! ain’t life grand :) VINEETO: I appreciate and understand your desire to talk to an experienced actualist but unfortunately for you I have essentially forgotten how to write. Words don’t come as easy and precise as when I wrote regularly on the mailing list and my inclination to search for them has all but disappeared. In the past nine years I have written close to a million words or more about the process and the pitfalls of becoming virtually free from the human condition and it’s all recorded on the Actual Freedom Trust website. There is also Peter’s Journal and his writings about his process of becoming virtually free, not to mention Richard’s extensive writings and reports. At this point I have nothing more to say, it would merely be a repetition of what I have said earlier, and much better, before. When you take the memory of your own PCE or of several PCEs and knock a peg in the ground for recognition and reference, then the attached thread makes an excellent guideline that will give you all the experiential clues and lived information about the actual world that you need and will reveal in what remarkable way the actual world is diametrically different to the real world of good and bad feelings and savage and tender instinctual passions. If you remember to be guided by your PCEs you can’t possibly miss. Bye.
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